Shining Force: SF1 Editor

[projectego]

Get well soon, RC. <3

[demanson]

I seem to have found an error in the editor program with the new single ranges editor when I click to add a new range the routines drop down seems to bug I can't click any of the options within it not even the top default one. After that I can't click any of the range dropdown options even in pre-existing ranges. If I don't click the plus sign to add a new range it works fine.

[Bilb Ono]

Hey guys,

I'm working on recreating Shining Force in Unity purely as an exercise in getting familiar with the tool set before working on an original SRPG (which is intended to be quite different from Shining Force, but that's neither here nor there).

I'm at the point where I need to start putting together the maps, which I initially planned on doing by hand. What I didn't remember about shining force is that the maps are made out of tiny little 8x8 pixel tiles... way too much to do by hand. My first idea was to stitch together screenshots of each area and scan them to generate the unique tiles and tile maps, but then I realized that the map data must be available in the ROM. After some searching I found this thread as well as rubixcuber's ROM map thread. Fantastic!

My goal right now is to pull the maps directly from the ROM into some more easily readable text file showing which 8x8 tiles are at which coordinates and on which layers so I can render these maps in the Unity engine. The editor seems to let you place these 8x8 tiles in 3x3 "subtile" groups, is this how the data is laid out in the ROM, or are the maps just a simple layout of the 8x8 tiles?

A followup question would be: is anyone aware of any existing resource that might have these tile maps defined?

[xenometal]

Welcome to forums, demanson.

Good job on finding that bug in the new range editor. It's quite critical too, as a range cannot work at all without having a routine assigned to it. Thankfully, you've still got the old editor to work with until that's fixed.

As for promotion stats, I was too curious to see how it would behave first hand, so I did a quick test. I put a value of 255 and promoted Mae at level 20, and it turns out that it works just as you'd expect (i.e. a value greater than 127 is treated as positive.) She ended up with base stats of 89 HP, 51 Attack and Defense and 53 Agility. That's not broken at all!

[projectego]

Well spotted, demanson! I hadn't even noticed this bug even after having combed through the Editor for improvement suggestions.

All this talk of the promotion stats as me wanting to see what it's capable of.

What's everyone working on so far? Any awesome mods in development?

[Lobo]

What's everyone working on so far? Any awesome mods in development?

Well, I did some work on that, but only by choosing characters, stats, spells and so.
Still long way from implementing any mod.

Right now, the mod needs the HQ to support more than 32 characters and some battle sprites.

I think I may restart playtesting soon enough though, as stats and events are working fine and need to be tested especificaly for the mod.

[projectego]

@Bilb Ono: Sounds like a very exciting project! I'm not aware of any such tools, personally, but hopefully another member can help steer you in the right direction. Do please keep us posted!

@Lobo: Sounds like a good idea to me, Lobo. I need to get some more playtesting done, also. You've managed to highlight some really important issues that need rectifying and I'm certain that it's a really big help for RC and the community.

Also, while RC's recovering (hope you're doing okay, man!), here are the Giant Scorpion battle sprites by my friend Dan:

[Lobo]

These sprites are awesome!
Seems to fit a very scary oponent!

[ShininGeek]

@Bilb Ono- The 8X8 subtiles in SFI should be easy to use, as you can extract them directly from the graphics editor as a .BMP file. Getting the 3X3 tiles, however, might be a bit difficult, as there are a LOT to go through. You can build them from scratch, but it will probably be easier to just use the 8X8 subtiles. A good majority of the time, you should be just filling an area with the same subtiles anyway (large stretches of plains, forest, or hills). The hardest thing to do, most likely, will be the mountain ranges, as each one is uniquely crafted. If you are against building the maps that way, you can open them in the editor and screenshot the sections to build them from much larger pieces, but that greatly limits your amount of creative liberty. Even so, it is entirely up to you how you choose to go about doing it.

[Mythrandir]

Those battle sprites are excellent! Projectego, can you tell Dan to make like 100 more enemies and heroes? We at least need a hero (outward facing) Kane battle sprite.

[Bilb Ono]

The 8X8 subtiles in SFI should be easy to use, as you can extract them directly from the graphics editor as a .BMP file. Getting the 3X3 tiles, however, might be a bit difficult, as there are a LOT to go through. You can build them from scratch, but it will probably be easier to just use the 8X8 subtiles. A good majority of the time, you should be just filling an area with the same subtiles anyway (large stretches of plains, forest, or hills). The hardest thing to do, most likely, will be the mountain ranges, as each one is uniquely crafted. If you are against building the maps that way, you can open them in the editor and screenshot the sections to build them from much larger pieces, but that greatly limits your amount of creative liberty. Even so, it is entirely up to you how you choose to go about doing it.

You're right that there is quite a lot to do, but I want to avoid taking shortcuts as much as possible in the way I implement the game in Unity. I want it to be as close to the way it is done in the ROM as possible, so I'm going to define the tiles the way they're stored: as 3x3 subtiles. According to the editor there are over 8000 such tiles, so I'm definitely not going to define each by hand. I'm going to get the tile definitions directly from the ROM based on the ROM map in the other thread. After that I'm going to get the map layouts directly from the ROM, preserving event locations and whatnot. The work done by some of the members of this community has made this much easier and I'm very grateful.

Do please keep us posted!

Will do. I'll put the Unity project on github as soon as there's anything worth sharing.

[projectego]

Those battle sprites are excellent! Projectego, can you tell Dan to make like 100 more enemies and heroes? We at least need a hero (outward facing) Kane battle sprite.

100 new enemies with unique battle and map sprite art would be a dream, and one that I'm slowly working towards, but Dan is an artist by profession and understandably requires payment for all work. So, while progress is ongoing, it's only as fast as I can afford to keep it that way. I'd absolutely encourage anyone here to give him a shout if you would like some custom Shining Force artwork done and he'll give you a price.

Me and Dan have been working on producing a pixel-perfect battle sprite for a playable version of Kane, but we're still a few frames short of a set (hehe!). Here's how Kane's looking so far:

[Lobo]

Looks great, projectego!

And how has Rubix been?
Recovered from the illness?
Any advance in your projects?

[projectego]

Breath of the Wild is a work killer, man!

Hopefully RC is enjoying some well-deserved rest. Sure, there are bugs within the Editor, but over the past several months he's been working on it nearly nonstop. Not gonna lie, though, I can't wait to see the Extended Characters content finished!

[Mythrandir]

So, while progress is ongoing, it's only as fast as I can afford to keep it that way. I'd absolutely encourage anyone here to give him a shout if you would like some custom Shining Force artwork done and he'll give you a price.

Really?! I'd be willing to contribute and have the sprites shared among the community here. Let me draw up some ideas and I'll send Dan a message.

Re: Kane sprite. You guys are too good. Looks excellent!

[projectego]

That would be awesome, thank you Mythrandir!

Also, it might be worth contacting RC and seeing if he will accept donations. He's put countless hours of work into the Editor and it would almost certainly help with future development if we're able to send some funds in his direction.

[Lobo]

Edit: Encountered my first major, game-breaking glitch: In Rindo, after completing the circus battle, acquiring the ship, losing the ship, speaking to the Mayor and having the path to Shade Abbey unlocked, I am no longer able to enter towns (or Shade Abbey) at all. Max just walks right over them as if they were standard tiles. Here's a recent savestate: (Download)

The savestate was made using Fusion v3.64 - sorry! It is saved right after the Circus battle, approx. 2 mins before encountering the game-breaking bug.

If it helps, the ROM was a clean and verified working before enabling the features listed above. No other changes have been applied. I was using v2.11.4 for that ROM, but will perform the update to it by saving the ROM once more using v2.11.6 and see if it fixes anything.

Edit: Here's a screenshot of Max standing on top of Shade Abbey, unable to enter:



The same goes for Rindo - can't re-enter that again either. Max is effectively stuck on the world map. Not sure if it's super relevant but he cannot go out of bounds or walk over the mountains, he still maintains the correct pathing. Just can't enter any towns.

Edit 2: Confirmed bug still present even after saving the ROM on the Characters screen using v2.11.6.

In the last couple of weeks I restarted the game three times, each one finishing early, after a crashing bug.

The first two had the game reseting after trying to leave some battle map. It happened after the circus battle (the game reseted when trying to leave the tent) and the second time after the second battle (the game reseted when trying to enter either Guardiana, Gate of Ancients, Alterone or the eastern village).

This bug had happened to me before, in other battle maps, but never that often. I then decided to give my emulator up and start playing in Retroarch.

I started a new game and went fine until trying to get to Shade Abbey. Then that same annoying bug that happened to you did happen to me.

Is there a way to overcome it and make the game go on?

[projectego]

Hey Lobo! So glad to see more activity in the thread!

I've had the Shade Abbey bug occur 2/2 for me and I have not managed to find a way past it. RC mentioned a page or two ago that it might be down to a flag not registering (I'm paraphrasing) or something along those lines.

I haven't had the game crash or reset on me yet, but I feel it's only a dice roll away with each playthrough. I wonder what might be causing all this? I fear that we may not be able to get to the bottom of this until RC returns from his break.

I really appreciate you taking the time to further playtest the new Editor features, Lobo. It's all a huge help for RC, I'm sure.

Anyone gotten in touch or heard from RC, by the way?

[Lobo]

I haven't.

My latest runs (those 3 I mentioned) were intended to test a mod where I put 6 extended characters, choosing stats and spells carefully and setting them to join at specific (and different) points of the game. I even changed some dialogues so that the story matches what I want (like the 'Kane dies.' line).

I wanted to test whether the events would work and the stats and spells would be balanced with other characters.

Unfortunately, I couldn't get very far and none of the six came to join.

[rubixcuber]

Sorry about the absense. Mix of things. Life, motivation, time, not being able to figure out the Shade Abbey thing.

On the bright side, I think I know what the issue is there now. I was going in circles because I assumed that the extended characters broke that, but I don't think that is the case. I believe it's the battle exit editing that broke that, and nobody had run into it yet.

That area is maybe the only map in the game that actually has three distinct versions with different paths. (Both closed, left open, both open). And I'd only built two sets into the editor.

So, I'll try to get a version out soon that fixes that and some other things and hopefully that will take care of that issue at least.

I'll try to address the latest suggestions/bugs as well and put out a version with a bunch of smaller updates and things sometime this week.