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Jap voices in English scenario 1

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Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby Profound » Mon Apr 05 2010 10:12am

-edit by Knight0fDragon-
read http://forums.shiningforcecentral.com/i ... ntry453947 also for info
-end edit-

Does anybody know if there is a way to replace the English voices with the Japanese ones in US/Pal scenario 1 ?

I noticed in my ISO Jap scenario 1 that the following files seem to correspond to voices :
- VOICELAR.SEQ
- VOICELAR.TON
- 140 files titled "vXXXXXX.SAP"

Regarding my patched PAL scenario 1 (translation team's patch), the ISO contains the following files regarding voices :
- VOICELAR.SEQ
- VOICELAR.TON
- VOICE.DAT

As the VOICE.DAT is roughly the same size of the 140 .SAP files contained in Jap scenario 1, I assume it is the same stuff. It just seems that voices have a different format in Jap and US/PAL scenarios 1 :
- For Jap, voices are made of several different files.
- For US/PAL, voices are gathered in a single file.

I tried the following :
- I put the 140 .SAP files from Jap. scenario 1 in the "sc1" files before patching my PAL scenario 1.
- I patched my PAL scenario 1.

But the patched ISO crashes just after the "Now loading" screen.
I think it is because the new patched ISO now contains the 140 .SAP files BUT also the old VOICE.DAT from PAL scenario 1. I think the old English VOICE.DAT needs to be removed for the game to play but I have no idea how to do so.

So :
- Is it possible with the patch software to actually remove that VOICE.DAT file when we patch an ISO ?
OR
- Is it possible to combine all the .SAP files from Japanese scenario 1 into a .DAT file ? (this way that .DAT file could replace the English one).

Thanks in advance for any advice.
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby knight0fdragon » Mon Apr 05 2010 3:09pm

what you need to do is combine all the sap files into a dat file


in cmd prompt, type copy voice1.sap+voice2.sap+...+voice141.sap voice.dat

please note that voice1.sap+voice2.sap+...+voice141.sap means add up all voice files, do not type that literally
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby Profound » Mon Apr 05 2010 3:21pm

Thanks, I'll give it a try (may take a while to type all the 140 files names... ouch).
Will all let you know if it works.

Update:
It still doesn't work with a VOICE.DAT created out of the jap. sc1 voice files.
There is really something weird with japanese sc1 as it is the only scenario with those .SAP files : Japanese sc2, sc3 and Premium Disc each have their own VOICE.DAT instead (like PAL/US sc1).
I tried everything, such as inserting Premium Disc VOICE.DAT in Patch Scenario 1 (as Premium Disc contains all voices from all 3 scenarios) but nothing works : the game freezes every time a voiced battle sentence is supposed to play.

I think that when PAL/US sc1 was released, Sega of America decided not to use the technique used in Jap. sc1 to input voices but the one used in Jap. sc2 (which was already released by then). As a result, PAL/US sc1 and Jap. sc2 voice system are probably not compatible (making it - sadly - impossible to replace English voices by Japanese ones...)
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby nagev2100 » Mon Apr 05 2010 10:00pm

This alternative would certainly be great!
There have been attempts from forum members to do so, but unfortunately they were all unsuccessful if I’m not mistaken.

Well, I just gave this a quick try, and here are my findings so far:

The game freezes at almost every voice (I tried various via sound test).
Interestingly not at voice number 10, 11 and 17, which are all from Masqurin, I guess. They work fine and can be endlessly repeated.

The working file names seem to be:

10 = V02S03
11 = V02S04
17 = V02S08

If you delete a file and it is missing in the voice.dat file -> the game will try to load it, but it won't freeze. (So, worst case scenario: playing with 3 working voice files?) ;)

What did I do?
I copied all 140 files (except TOSHI.SAP which is the melody of the title screen I guess) into a folder, started CMD, moved into the folder and typed the copy command-line, then copied the voice.dat file into s1 and patched it.

I have also some older files from someone who seems to have sorted out the proper 134 files for scenario 1. I tried these files too and it is the same as above, but with voice 6 working. ;) Maybe I missed it in my previous tries...

Unfortunately, I don’t know why some of these voices work. Is it because of the length, the name or the file size?

Oh, and a hint:
Instead of writing all these file names down - this should also do the job:

command-line:
copy /b *.* VOICE.DAT
(or also possible) copy /b *.SAP VOICE.DAT

Maybe someday someone solves this?
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby knight0fdragon » Tue Apr 06 2010 7:01am

doing it that way will mess up the order of things


perhaps the samplesare different hz, check out the custom voice sticky, you may need to resample the voices
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby Profound » Tue Apr 06 2010 8:31am

Isn't it possible to simply remove the US/PAL VOICE.DAT in the patching process and replace it with all the .SAP files from the Japanese version ?

As I said above, I tried to upload all the .SAP files in the patching process. It worked but the US/PAL VOICE.DAT remained and as a consequence, it was impossible to launch the game : it crashed immediately, surely because there were both the English and Japanese voices in it and the game got confused.

Update :
I removed the VOICE.DAT file from the patch version (using WinISO) but the game crashed.
I then compared the contents of the Jap. ISO vs Patched ISO : the only notable difference is that in the Jap. ISO there is the TOSHI.SAP (which naveg2100 mentioned) which is not in the Patched ISO.
Besides, there are a couple of files which have a difference size between Jap. and Patched ISO (1ST.BIN, SEGALOGO.SPK, RAIL1.MPD, ENDLOGO.SPR, CDDA2 and several X....BIN files).
I tried to reinsert the original files from the Jap. ISO in the Patched ISO but the game still crashes.

I have no idea why it doesn't work...
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby nagev2100 » Tue Apr 06 2010 12:01pm

knight0fdragon @ Tue Apr 06, 2010 7:01 am) wrote:doing it that way will mess up the order of things

As long as the file names in the folder have the correct alphabetical order it should work fine, I believe. But I don?t want to give others bad hints, so maybe you could clarify that please?

knight0fdragon @ Tue Apr 06, 2010 7:01 am) wrote:perhaps the samplesare different hz, check out the custom voice sticky, you may need to resample the voices

Mhm, maybe its the hz. But would they differ from file to file?
Haven't people tried to resample them and it also didn?t work? Can you imagine why it didn?t work? And even more interestingly - has it ever been done right? ;)

Well, I see two kind of problems.
1. The correct order (140 JP files against 134 EN files at the sound test)
2. To get the new DAT file with the Japanese SAP files within to work in game.

Maybe a detailed step-by-step guide of what needs to be done would help and make people proceed in this case?
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby knight0fdragon » Tue Apr 06 2010 4:25pm

the way the voices get ordered when using *.* is

1.sap
10.sap
11.sap
...
2.sap
21.sap


perhaps there are more voices in the jap version which makes it bug out, also there might be an issue with jap version of voices being larger then eng



also see http://forums.shiningforcecentral.com/i ... ntry453947

for another attempt done at this.


best way to test it,

break the file down like i describe in the voice translation

swap only the first voice from eng to jap

rebuild and test
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby Profound » Tue Apr 06 2010 8:19pm

I think the best bet would be to discover how the voice system works in Jap. sc1 and duplicate it in the US/PAL sc1.
Imo, the fact that there is a VOICE.DAT in US/PAL sc1 and several .SAP files in Jap. sc1 is just the tip of the iceberg.
There must be something else and I doubt it has something to do with the voices length.
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby nagev2100 » Tue Apr 06 2010 11:37pm

knight0fdragon @ Tue Apr 06, 2010 4:25 pm) wrote:the way the voices get ordered when using *.* is

1.sap
10.sap
11.sap
...
2.sap
21.sap

Ah, I see. Thx. But it doesn?t matter in this case. The names of the JP files are:

V00S01
V00S02
?
V01S01
V01S02
?

knight0fdragon @ Tue Apr 06, 2010 4:25 pm) wrote:best way to test it,

break the file down like i describe in the voice translation

swap only the first voice from eng to jap

rebuild and test

Hmm, too bad it doesn?t seem to work. At the moment I can't make head nor tail of it. Here is what i did:

At first I arranged the files:
Converted the English voice.dat into a wave file. Split it with WAVChop. Transferred the first few files back into sap format, copied them together and patched the game. Voices work fine in the sound test.

So I converted all wav files back and tested it -> works fine in sound test. That?s the upside. (with nothing won) ;)

Concerning the Japanese voices copied together with the English voices...

1. Just swapped the first file -> First voice does actually load, but no sound -> all others freeze.
2. Just swapped the second file -> First (English) voice plays fine, but everything else -> freeze.
3. Tried the V02S03.SAP file that I mentioned above on place number one -> this Japanese voice works, but all other voices afterwards freeze.
4. The file at position 11 has 34KB and V00S03.SAP has that too, so I swapped them -> Voices before work, but itself and everything afterwards freezes.

Can you think of something else that might work?
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby Kaz » Wed Apr 07 2010 4:51pm

Profound @ Tue Apr 06, 2010 8:19 pm) wrote: I think the best bet would be to discover how the voice system works in Jap. sc1 and duplicate it in the US/PAL sc1.
Imo, the fact that there is a VOICE.DAT in US/PAL sc1 and several .SAP files in Jap. sc1 is just the tip of the iceberg.
There must be something else and I doubt it has something to do with the voices length.

Seems to me if theres this big of a difference, the best solution would be to make an English patch for the Japanese version, since we already know the English script. It may even be simpler than that if the English script is stored in a file already?
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby Profound » Wed Apr 07 2010 7:49pm

Sorry for bringing up this topic, guys.
I never imagined it would be so complicated...
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby knight0fdragon » Thu Apr 08 2010 5:06am

I do not want to dig though my files, could somebody post a sap file for me to look at
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby nagev2100 » Thu Apr 08 2010 10:37am

Sure.

Here you are.

http://www.mediafire.com/?zinkadwdozj
The first file (Synbios)

If you need more for reference:
http://www.mediafire.com/?zdmintoyzti
Zip with all jp voice files
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby knight0fdragon » Thu Apr 08 2010 4:05pm

wont download
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby nagev2100 » Thu Apr 08 2010 7:33pm

should work now
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby knight0fdragon » Fri Apr 09 2010 6:10pm

ok the issue becomes a 16bit endian issue, so you need to find a program that swaps every 2 bytes to get it to convert correctly


give this program a try

http://halfbitstudios.com/sf3/endianswap.zip

basically drop the sap file on it, it will create a sas file, then rebuild voice.dat with it
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby Bulzome » Sat Apr 10 2010 7:55am

Kaz @ Wed Apr 07, 2010 8:51 am) wrote: ...make an English patch for the Japanese version, since we already know the English script...

Actually, I'm working on that. I'll probably let LF, KOD, or someone know when I'm done. I want to be sure everything goes through the proper channels.
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby nagev2100 » Sat Apr 10 2010 9:11am

knight0fdragon @ Fri Apr 09, 2010 6:10 pm) wrote: give this program a try

http://halfbitstudios.com/sf3/endianswap.zip

basically drop the sap file on it, it will create a sas file, then rebuild voice.dat with it

I am sorry, but it is not working either.

It produces the same freezes as before. I swapped the first file of the EN voices with the first sas file, renamed it and built the voice.dat. Then i tried some of the sas files copied together.

Maybe there is more to it?

I just swapped the first two files of my split English voices and it also freezes. The voices afterwards worked. (Unlike the general freeze of voices afterwards, that I got when combined with the JP files)

Is there something else that causes the program to freeze?
Well, it would also be good to have someone else try this to compare the results.
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Re: Jap voices in English scenario 1

Postby Profound » Sat Apr 10 2010 9:25am

nagev2100 @ Sat Apr 10, 2010 9:11 am) wrote: I am sorry, but it is not working either.

It produces the same freezes as before. I swapped the first file of the EN voices with the first sas file, renamed it and built the voice.dat. Then i tried some of the sas files copied together.

Maybe there is more to it?

I just swapped the first two files of my split English voices and it also freezes. The voices afterwards worked. (Unlike the general freeze of voices afterwards, that I got when combined with the JP files)

Is there something else that causes the program to freeze?
Well, it would also be good to have someone else try this to compare the results.

I did the same and it is not working either.

I don't understand why the VOICE.DAT made out of the Japanese voices is so small (582ko), compared to the one in US/PAL scenario 1 with English voices (4 792ko).
It is probably the reason why it isn't working.
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