To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sun Jul 10 2005 5:20pm
by Spear God
Is it better to buy it and encourage Sega to make an another and maybe real Shining Force game or not to buy it to express our disappointment for having denatured our favorite game?
I don't ask if it it's a good game or not...

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sun Jul 10 2005 5:33pm
by Kimimi
Sega will just think that "Shining Force" doesn't sell if nobody buys it, they aren't going to know that it was passed up because fans are unhappy with the game - sales figures are just that - numbers.
Buy because you like the sound of the game or don't because you don't; the only way to express the feelings you're mentioning is to email Sega directly.

BTW, I'm enjoying the game very much - will do a quick write up whenever I get the chance.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sun Jul 10 2005 8:02pm
by Geoffrey Duke
If you buy this game, you are showing your support for the direction Sega has taken the series in, and that will only encourage Sega to turn it into a series. That's how the games industry operates. If Shining Force Neo sells well, Sega isn't going to make another "Shining Force" game that doesn't having the same "winning formula". Once SF Neo entrenches itself, Sega will simply expand on that foothold (brand recognition) with more of the same money making gameplay.

For that reason alone I ask fans of the series to boycott Shining Force Neo regardless of however good it might be. Show your support for Strategy/RPGs by buying Fire Emblem for the GameCube instead.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Mon Jul 11 2005 2:03am
by 69
Sorry, but I'm buying it. I know it's not a true Force game, but the videos and screen shots look like it will be a lot of fun. In the end that is what matters when I purchase a game.


Duke- What can also happen if you don't show your support is SEGA can scrap the Shining series all together if this one bombs. You really don't think things through do you, because I'm pretty sure not all of us REQUIRE our games we enjoy to be Strat/RPGs. So not buying the game thinking that will get things through to SEGA, that isn't going to work.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Mon Jul 11 2005 2:30am
by Geoffrey Duke
69 @ Mon Jul 11, 2005 2:03 am) wrote: You really don't think things through do you, because I'm pretty sure not all of us REQUIRE our games we enjoy to be Strat/RPGs.

Not everyone no. But fans of the older games who don't happen to be fans of Dark Alliance/Diablo/Gauntlet at the same time aren't exactly going to welcome this game with open arms.

I'm sure everyone will be jumping with joy when Shining Force Neo 2 is announced.

What bothers me the most is that the guy overseeing this series seems to think that Strategy/RPGs like Fire Emblem don't belong on home consoles, and the people at Sega of America have already hailed SF Neo as an improvement to the original games. Things are looking pretty grim at the moment.

Do you really want to support their narrow outlook on this series? Personally, I see no compelling reason why we all can't enjoy the best of both worlds.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Mon Jul 11 2005 3:25am
by Tarethen
It'll be picking it up the day of release. While I'm an avid fan of the past strategy titles in the series, I don't see the problem in a little change. Shining Tears was nice, and I think Neo will be a bit better.

And, I usually don't like action RPGs. I'm more turn-based and tactical/strategy, but I've like what I've seen about Neo, and I've heard nothing but great things from it... Except for those who are far too annoyed at Sega because they use a well known name just to make an action title.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Mon Jul 11 2005 6:33pm
by Spear God
I'm agree with Geoffrey Duke...even if it's a good game, I don't think I'll buy it! Or maybe one day in second-hand...I hope Sega will not use again the word "Force" in a Shining game except for Shining Force 4! They have to become reconciled with Camelot I think, I don't know if Sega is able to do a fantastic real Shining Force game without their help... :fear:

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Mon Jul 11 2005 6:50pm
by Kimimi
I don't know if Sega is able to do a fantastic real Shining Force game without their help...


...because Sega have never done anything decent without Camelot, of course.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Mon Jul 11 2005 8:57pm
by TKTOWA
Kimimi @ Mon Jul 11, 2005 12:50 pm) wrote: ...because Sega have never done anything decent without Camelot, of course.

Never! I love Sega and they rock! They still release great games, the only dissapointment right now is what they're doing to Shining Force. Everyone feels it is important to ONLY focus on their mistake and not focus on all their other great games. Shining games are the "little guys" of RPGs. Sure, we all just adore the games but just about everyone else likes other RPGs. Most people havent even heard of the Shining series and even after Shining Force Neo it still wont get its recognition. We have to face that Shining games aren't as popular so Sega has to make changes to appeal to the majority.

It's called business.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Tue Jul 12 2005 7:10am
by Alones
TKTOWA @ Mon Jul 11, 2005 8:57 pm) wrote: Never! I love Sega and they rock! They still release great games, the only dissapointment right now is what they're doing to Shining Force. Everyone feels it is important to ONLY focus on their mistake and not focus on all their other great games. Shining games are the "little guys" of RPGs. Sure, we all just adore the games but just about everyone else likes other RPGs. Most people havent even heard of the Shining series and even after Shining Force Neo it still wont get its recognition. We have to face that Shining games aren't as popular so Sega has to make changes to appeal to the majority.

It's called business.

Yeah... they only wants money and money...

And because that they sacrified our beloved shining force to make a new shining force, or, sometimes called, a MIERDA ¬¬

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Jul 13 2005 12:13am
by TKTOWA
Either way money is money and everyone wants it. If you're not part of the majority you aren't important. Being the minority I dislike as much as everyone else here but squabbling over it and making a fuss is pointless because we aren't that important.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Jul 13 2005 1:45am
by Geoffrey Duke
It's a different story in Japan though where not only are Strategy/RPGs still a popular genre and therefore far from the verge of extinction, but where RPGs rake in the most sales (nothing is more popular than RPGs in Japan). Sega helped pioneer this particular genre (with games like Dragon Force), so why is returning to the development of these games really so impossible to believe?

If Sega has any intention of turning the Shining series into one of its flagship series of RPGs, then I expect Sega to either unveil Shining Force Neo 2 or Shining Force IV at this year's Tokyo Game Show for either the PS2 or possibly even a next generation console.

I know how much many gamers love button mashing their way through Action/"RPGs" today, but that doesn't mean the market should be saturated with those types of "RPGs" at the expense of all others. The tragedy of it all is turn-based RPGs have now become a dying breed because the market has become so dominated by casual players lacking in the patience department.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Jul 13 2005 1:49am
by TKTOWA
Geoffrey Duke @ Tue Jul 12, 2005 7:45 pm) wrote: Action/"RPGs"

I call them Hack and Slash because they dont have enough to be an RPG. :p
Unless your playing as a mage. Because instead of just hitting X rapidly you have to dodge long range attacks and send them back, that makes it more interesting. Thats why Shining Tears was okay, because you werent always button mashing through a group.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Jul 13 2005 5:22am
by Shevek
Hi all. I am new to the forums but am a longtime fan of the Shining Force series. Anyways, i registered just so I could post here and chime in on this.

I have seen many titles I have liked sold out for name recognition. I am (mostly) a PC gamer that dabbles in some console titles. On the PC side of things, I have seen this happen many times. Three of the best PC series (XCom, Baldur's Gate and Fallout) had thier names used by the publisher in much the same way Sega is using Shining Force. Like this community, fans wondered what to do about the new titles. Should they buy to support the name of the series they like (known to publishers as the IP or Independent Property) or boycott the title in hopes that the publisher will return to making the title the right way. Honestly guys, you are screwed either way.

First, you need to understand that the people in charge of these decisions are not gamers (at least, not in the hardcore sense). The people making these decisions are business majors. In the words of the great Maddox, these are the jerks who acted like asses in high School, couldnt find work, then went to college and got business degrees so they could figure out how to bs and take credit for other peoples work. They do not appreciate or respect the kinds of games you like. The breed of individuals in charge of these decisions are slaves to industry buzzwords like "accessible," "action packed" and "role playing." Instead of making good games, they try to figure out how to make all these buzzwords happen at the same time (which isnt always possible when you try to make a deep and involving game). When you try to pitch them games that require patience and thought, they reject the idea because it doesnt fit into "accessible." In other words, dont hold your breath for an actual Shining Force by Sega in this market. Maybe if a developer like nippon ichi, who is dedicated to a niche market (a rare thing) owned the IP and self published, then it would happen but this isnt the case.

As to what to do, I will break it down for you. Everyone is right. If you buy action rpgs, then you add to the sale of action rpgs. The sales figures tell the idiot business majors in marketting that action rpgs = $$$. If you dont buy it, they will blame the IP because other action titles sell (damn mass market). Guys, you just cant win. My only advise to you is to make sure to support the kinda of games you like. Buy SRPGs if they are your thing and try not to buy action titles based on hype alone. This, at least, may help you send some sort of message the decision makers can understand though it may take a while for them to get it (if ever).

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Thu Jul 14 2005 12:35am
by Geoffrey Duke
It's ironic that you referenced one of Maddox's comments since he's a Sega and Panzer Dragoon fan himself. I'd love to see him tear apart Shining Force Neo on his site, because with a readership as huge as his, he could send this game back into the fiery pits of hell to burn for all eternity where it belongs. :thumbsup:

Anyway, I don't want to see Sega turn Shining Force Neo into a series, so I will be steering clear of the game.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Thu Jul 14 2005 9:54pm
by 69
Geoffrey Duke @ Wed Jul 13, 2005 6:35 pm) wrote: It's ironic that you referenced one of Maddox's comments since he's a Sega and Panzer Dragoon fan himself. I'd love to see him tear apart Shining Force Neo on his site, because with a readership as huge as his, he could send this game back into the fiery pits of hell to burn for all eternity where it belongs. :thumbsup:

Anyway, I don't want to see Sega turn Shining Force Neo into a series, so I will be steering clear of the game.

And out of your own ignorance and stupidity you will never play another new Shining Force game again.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sat Jul 16 2005 6:02am
by Arc_the_Lad
Nope, doesn't look appealing at all to me.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Mon Jul 18 2005 3:06pm
by Odd_Eye
I lik this post... I am been wondering ever since i heard the battle system is like that of shining tears. Whether i should get this game??

Can anyone give me advice on wherther to buy it or not? For Shining Tears, i felt damn bored with it... although the characters are good. i felt that the battle system is really boring me...

So... Whether to buy or not? Anyone with advice?

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Tue Aug 30 2005 11:30am
by Sailorcancer
I'm going to buy it XD I've been waiting for the game for a while and if it's a huge let down then I'll just give it to GameStop. Then again it can be good, nontheless the game is worth renting or borrowing from a friend.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Aug 31 2005 12:26am
by Kakizaki
Although I am disappointed Neo will not be a 'classic' Shining title, I still will be picking it up due to the fact I thoroughly enjoyed Record of Lodoss on Dreamcast. I can understand being upset, but it almost seems the equivalent of denying yourself Shining Force because it strayed from the original dungeon crawl genre of the first Shining title. I actually enjoy dungeon crawlers more, and was very happy with StHA, but because the next title in the series, SF III, was a strat rpg, I wasn't about to boycott. In the longrun you are only hurting SEGA in general. I think I would slit my own throat had I not picked up Azel Panzer Dragoon because it wasn't a rail shooter. :confused:

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Aug 31 2005 12:43am
by Demonic Weasel
Good point, however from my point of veiw it's like this. I am very annoyed that Sega has just screwed SF over like this, but I would take the same approach as you depending on the quality of the game. Since Neo doesn't look like it has much quality either, I therefore probably won't get it. I might rent it just to see if it actually is any good but...

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Aug 31 2005 1:47am
by Kakizaki
With Neverland lending a hand in Neo's development, I think it will be worth a peek. Lufia (Estopolis) I & II, Record of Lodoss, and Chaos Seed is a pretty decent track record for a developer.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Aug 31 2005 2:59am
by Demonic Weasel
I'm just saying that from what I've seen so far I'm not impressed.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Tue Sep 20 2005 6:13pm
by Geoffrey Duke
Kakizaki @ Wed Aug 31, 2005 12:26 am) wrote: Although I am disappointed Neo will not be a 'classic' Shining title, I still will be picking it up due to the fact I thoroughly enjoyed Record of Lodoss on Dreamcast. I can understand being upset, but it almost seems the equivalent of denying yourself Shining Force because it strayed from the original dungeon crawl genre of the first Shining title. I actually enjoy dungeon crawlers more, and was very happy with StHA, but because the next title in the series, SF III, was a strat rpg, I wasn't about to boycott. In the longrun you are only hurting SEGA in general. I think I would slit my own throat had I not picked up Azel Panzer Dragoon because it wasn't a rail shooter. :confused:

You just don't get it, do you? Sega can make all the Action/RPGs it wants but Sega has no real right to call them Shining Force. Where's the force in Shining Force Neo? How can you play as a force of one? Do tell. Of course, Sega has every right to do whatever the hell it wants with its own intellectual properties, but it's never a wise move to redefine a name such as this. It would be akin to Square-Enix making an Action/RPG and calling it The Forbidden Series Tactics.

Your PD Saga anology is flawed as well for the simple reason that Azel: Panzer Dragoon RPG was labelled differently from the rail shooters. The people at Sega didn't call PD Orta... Azel: Panzer Dragoon RPG 2, now did they? Why you ask? Because that would be misleading. A misnomer if you will.

You want to see more Action/RPGs from Sega instead of traditional Force-style games? Then buy Shining Force Neo.

It's nice to know that you Diablo-loving fools with your short attention spans killed Shining Force. Thanks. I hope you enjoy all that mindless button mashing in your watered down Action/RPGs. I'm sure Sega will throw in some voice acting too to spare you the painful process of reading too much. Have fun.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Tue Sep 20 2005 7:38pm
by Bower captain of death !!!
it's by the same guys who made record of lodoss war int it, well i thought that game was bloody awesome! so im definately going to be buying Neo!

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Tue Sep 20 2005 9:34pm
by Tarethen
Geoffrey Duke @ Tue Sep 20, 2005 1:13 pm) wrote:

You want to see more Action/RPGs from Sega instead of traditional Force-style games? Then buy Shining Force Neo.

It's nice to know that you Diablo-loving fools with your short attention spans killed Shining Force. Thanks. I hope you enjoy all that mindless button mashing in your watered down Action/RPGs. I'm sure Sega will throw in some voice acting too to spare you the painful process of reading too much. Have fun.

You know, attitudes like that are a real way to just get under people's skins. Just because someone is buying an action RPG, doesn't mean they're some mindless moron. So the name is Shining Force Neo, so what? We already know -you're- not going to buy it, as you've been chiming in to say every single chance you've gotten. But, we don't need to keep hearing about your disgust and dislike for what Sega has done each and every thread. You're beating a dead horse.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Tue Sep 20 2005 9:50pm
by Geoffrey Duke
This horse isn't quite dead yet. Once it flops in the U.S. then I'll let the issue go. The bottom line is: if you buy this game, you hammer a nail into the coffin of traditional Force-style games. End of discussion.

Hack and slash games can be fun, but that shouldn't be the full extent of their gameplay. Unfortunately, that's the direction modern-day Action/RPGs have gone in because "gamers" just don't have the patience for anything else. Too bad.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Tue Sep 20 2005 10:09pm
by Tarethen
Geoffrey Duke @ Tue Sep 20, 2005 4:50 pm) wrote: This horse isn't quite dead yet. Once it flops in the U.S. then I'll let the issue go. The bottom line is: if you buy this game, you hammer a nail into the coffin of traditional Force-style games. End of discussion.

Hack and slash games can be fun, but that shouldn't be the full extent of their gameplay. Unfortunately, that's the direction modern-day Action/RPGs have gone in because "gamers" just don't have the patience for anything else. Too bad.

I'm buying the game because I am generally interested in it. Because, I know, that if I ever wanted to play a Force style game, I can sit right down at my computer, or go and turn my TV and Saturn on and play one. The games haven't lost their novelty and general aura around them to the point where I can't live without a new Force style game.

Also, I don't consider buying the game as nailing the final nail into the coffin of the Shining series. The game met with rather nice response when it came to reviews and general impressions. In my opinion, that is something good. People are enjoying the game. Awesome. I want to enjoy the game, too. Not keep sitting here wishing about how the game should have been or could have been when I can sit and enjoy what the game is.

You don't see a whole lot of Suikoden fans crying and moaning and groaning because they're adding a tactical RPG into the Suikoden series. A lot of fans are welcoming it with open arms as something new. I think Shining fans should - at least- give the game a try by getting it from Gamefly or Blockbuster instead of just saying "No, I'm not going to play that because Sega didn't give me what I wanted. I hate Sega." Because, you never know, they might actually -like it-.

I've heard from several places that the new Shining game has a good story, too. That's another reason why I want to play it. I want to see what kind of story Sega came up with to augment the new gameplay. In a nutshell, I'm interested in seeing how Sega handled this new game. If we get a Shining Force Neo II, so be it. It won't be the end of my world, and I highly doubt it'll be the end of Sega or the end of a whole lot of other people's world. If someone needs to go and commit suicide because Shining Force IV hasn't come out yet, then there's some sort of problem.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Fri Oct 14 2005 8:59am
by Chaos Wizard
Although I don't like the use of the word Force in the title of a non-strategic RPG. I still fully intend on buying as it still looks like a cool game. As a lot of you know I've been playing Shining Games since the SitD came out. I've played them all, and they are all good games. I think this one will be good too. It looks like a lot of fun. Sega even said originally they were going to make it a strat-rpg but thought the strat system didn't cross into 3d very well. I guess that's there deal as I don't care if a game is 3d or 2d. Neo isn't a strat-rpg granted, but who's to say Sega will never put out another Shining Strat RPG? In any case I'm picking it up, and will post my honest opinion on the game, good or bad. I'll write about the pros and the cons. Personally I'm looking forward to this the newest consule addition to the Shining Series.

I myself am not a button mashing mindless gamer that lacks patience. Neither are several of my gaming friends, also fans of the Shining Games, who are also exited to play SFNeo.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sun Oct 16 2005 10:31pm
by LunarPark
I sold a lot of my shining stock about a year or two ago when I was in the midst of a crippling and life-altering depression. So right now I am trying to reacquire what I have lost; hence, I will not be buying the new Shining Force games, with the exception of the remake of Shining Force I for the GBA. Also, I cannot get past the new game's pastel color scheme and bland character designs, or the fact that it is neither turn-based nor tactical.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Oct 19 2005 3:11am
by Geoffrey Duke
Chaos Wizard @ Fri Oct 14, 2005 8:59 am) wrote: Sega even said originally they were going to make it a strat-rpg but thought the strat system didn't cross into 3d very well.

What a lame excuse. Take one look at the new Fire Emblem game for the GameCube, and then tell us that these games don't cross over to 3D very well. Even Riglord Saga for the Saturn demonstrated how much potential these games have when taken into the 3D realm. Give it a graphical upgrade and you have yourself a winner.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Oct 19 2005 4:00am
by Parn
Curious... anyone have any sales figures for Shining Force Neo in Japan? It's going to flop in the US, and I'm just curious as to how it did in Japan. I basically am looking to laugh some more.

Meanwhile, Nintendo has released Fire Emblem, a strategy/RPG for GameCube, and is currently airing COMMERCIALS for it on television. It should be interesting to see if it sells well.

Waiting for my copy to arrive in the mail. Going to pass Shining Force Neo, I'm afraid. I'll play Ys: Oath in Felghana for my action/RPG fix (which by the way, Ys: Oath in Felghana is completely awesome with a soundtrack that DESTROYS Shining Force Neo's uninspired garbage).

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Thu Oct 20 2005 9:12am
by Chaos Wizard
G-Duke: I agree that is a lame excuse, and I still play tactical RPG's, like SF, Ogre Battle, Disgeia, Phatom Brave, and Tactics, which have all done really well. (I even play tabletop strategy games.) I wholely and truely hope there is a future strat-rpg for SF. I would love to play it, and I know there is a market. It might not be a huge one in comparrison to the Halo/Doom/Unreal Shooter Games, and Sports Games. Which to me are the bottom of the gaming food chain. The hack n slash games aren't the best, but it's still a possiblity it might not be horrible. I'm getting it tomorrow hopefully unless the day has been pushed back again. If anything, if it's like another game I can tell you, and give you a reference of comparrison for you to make your over all call on the game.

From what I've heard about the game though, and the screen shots that I've seen, it does look fun. It obviously won't get me going like a strat-rpg. All and all I still say it looks like a good game.

Parn: I haven't seen anything negative about Neo outside of the SFC community. Everyone that I know of that's heard of the game seems interested in at least checking it out. I doubt it will flop. But I also doubt it will outsell Fire Embelm.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Thu Oct 20 2005 12:35pm
by Aspartate
I haven't seen anything positive about Neo in Chinese Shining community. Non-Shining gamers find it amusing because it's a remake of "The Record of Lodoss War" from DreamCast, not because of some Shininblahblahblah they never heard of and doesn't care about.

Its system is really nice (after all, it's RoLW). Graphic is gorgeous (Studio 4 degrees Celsius huh, I think Sega spent most of their budget on this). But its story? From the background setting it looks like there's a lot of potential. Too bad the scriptwriter wasted it and turned it into a childish play. I wonder how many people will love it so much after this game is released in a language they can understand. People also had high hopes for Shining Soul's story before it was released in English.

And now, after 6 months of its release, people who used to discuss it eagerly say, "oh, it's fun. But that's all it is. Played it, finished it, and forgot about it. Too many games were released each month. There's nothing special enough to remember or make you want to play this again."
Another great conversation I saw was:
A: I bought this so-called complete guide and there's no story translation in it! The only reason I buy a guide is for its story! I'm robbed!
B: There's hardly any story in Neo. You didn't miss a thing.

Parn-
Famitsu sales (calculated from 2004/12/27~2005/6/26):
Berwick Saga (PS2, released on 5/26) - 160,460
Fire Emblem- Path of Radiance (NGC, released on 4/20) - 150,420
Neo (PS2, released on 3/24)- 94,379

Fire Emblem wins by a mile. Berwick even more. I'm surprised that nobody mentions Berwick Saga here. Berwick Saga is a sequel of Tear Ring Saga, which was made by the producer of Fire Emblem on SNES. Japanese speaking (and Chinese speaking) Fire Emblem fans treat FE series and TRS series as sisters.
While Neo offers lovely graphics and simple hack-and-slash fun, Berwick Saga is known of its small characters, dated graphic (PSone can handle that), outrageously hard and user-unfriendly battles. And although the music of Berwick is marvelous, hardly anyone heard of the composer. (As opposed to Neo's "Hey! The music is composed by the person who did Evangelion! Buy! Buy!")
I find this quite amusing. Neo is dressed like a princess (character design, graphic, music, story all made by so-very-famous people; plus tons of advertisements) while Berwick Saga is like a Cinderella without fairy's help (everything made by Mr. Nobody). Yet Cinderella got more attention. I wonder what the biggies in Sega think when they see Berwick's success.
Berwick Saga promotional movie. Classic SRPG. The music and medieval atmosphere is fabulous. I doubt it will ever hit the shores of North America though, as Enterbrain isn't too keen on overseas market.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Thu Oct 20 2005 5:54pm
by Tortie
Aspartate @ Thu Oct 20, 2005 6:35 am) wrote: Berwick Saga promotional movie. Classic SRPG. The music and medieval atmosphere is fabulous. I doubt it will ever hit the shores of North America though, as Enterbrain isn't too keen on overseas market.

Now that looks interesting. And exactly like Fire Emblem. :lol: I had a chance to listen to the soundtrack a while ago and was very impressed, even though I had no idea what Berwick Saga was. It's a shame localisation isn't very likely, it looks like something oldschool gamers would enjoy.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Tue Oct 25 2005 1:46pm
by lyinghart
buy!

though it is not a S-RPG,but it also has much fun

i have played the jan-version for 80 hours

now i begin to play the us-vision

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sun Oct 30 2005 5:38am
by Minos
I'll also say that it's a good buy.

By doing this, you're encouraging Sega to support/contract Neverland.
By doing this, you're supporting the Shining storyline.
By doing this, you're supporting the action RPG genre.


And you'll get some good, clean fun.


But if you don't like action rpgs, like Gauntlet, then don't buy it.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sun Oct 30 2005 1:31pm
by Thief
Aspartate @ Thu Oct 20, 2005 12:35 pm) wrote: Parn-
Famitsu sales (calculated from 2004/12/27~2005/6/26):
Berwick Saga (PS2, released on 5/26) - 160,460
Fire Emblem- Path of Radiance (NGC, released on 4/20) - 150,420
Neo (PS2, released on 3/24)- 94,379

Fire Emblem wins by a mile. Berwick even more. I'm surprised that nobody mentions Berwick Saga here. Berwick Saga is a sequel of Tear Ring Saga, which was made by the producer of Fire Emblem on SNES.
While Neo offers lovely graphics and simple hack-and-slash fun, Berwick Saga is known of its small characters, dated graphic (PSone can handle that), outrageously hard and user-unfriendly battles. And although the music of Berwick is marvelous, hardly anyone heard of the composer. (As opposed to Neo's "Hey! The music is composed by the person who did Evangelion! Buy! Buy!")
I find this quite amusing. Neo is dressed like a princess (character design, graphic, music, story all made by so-very-famous people; plus tons of advertisements) while Berwick Saga is like a Cinderella without fairy's help (everything made by Mr. Nobody). Yet Cinderella got more attention. I wonder what the biggies in Sega think when they see Berwick's success.
Berwick Saga promotional movie. Classic SRPG. The music and medieval atmosphere is fabulous. I doubt it will ever hit the shores of North America though, as Enterbrain isn't too keen on overseas market.

Berwick Saga outsold Fire Emblem GC? Mwuahahaha~
This post made my day. :)

Japanese speaking (and Chinese speaking) Fire Emblem fans treat FE series and TRS series as sisters.


It's too bad the English-speaking fans are mostly Nintendo fanboys who denied BWS' share of sRPG love on this side of the Pacific. <.<

Well, I'm playing both Neo and BWS at the moment. They're both pretty fun games, even if Neo's story fell short of "epic"-ness. My recommendation? Get Neo if you want a fun action RPG kind of game, otherwise look out for BWS or even that FE: Path of Radiance (if you're lucky enough to have a GC) for the Shining-like simulation RPG experience.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sun Oct 30 2005 8:08pm
by Casper Rogue
Spear God @ Mon Jul 11, 2005 6:33 pm) wrote:I'm agree with Geoffrey Duke...even if it's a good game, I don't think I'll buy it!

This may sound like flaming, but that has got to be the stupidest statement I've ever read in my life.


The simple fact that Sega continued the Shining Stories should say something about how much potential they think the series has. So what it isn't a turn-based strategy. Is the game good? That would be the point. Other RPGs have evolved into better ones and I dont see people whining about that. What is wrong with you all? Get over yourself and just pick up a copy to see if it's worth your time or not. Then complain about it if it sucks.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sun Oct 30 2005 9:18pm
by Geoffrey Duke
Casper Rogue @ Sun Oct 30, 2005 8:08 pm) wrote: This may sound like flaming, but that has got to be the stupidest statement I've ever read in my life. 


The simple fact that Sega continued the Shining Stories should say something about how much potential they think the series has.  So what it isn't a turn-based strategy.  Is the game good?  That would be the point.  Other RPGs have evolved into better ones and I dont see people whining about that.  What is wrong with you all?  Get over yourself and just pick up a copy to see if it's worth your time or not.  Then complain about it if it sucks.

Other RPGs have evolved into better ones? So are you implying that SF Neo is the next step in this series' evolution as if hack 'n' slash RPGs are far more engrossing and rewarding than the tactical turn-based SF RPGs of old many of us grew up on?

If so, you're a blind fool.

SF Neo is a great game for what it is so I hear (from people within Sega as well). So what? We never wanted it in the first place. If SF Neo is the future of this series, then count me out. It makes me wonder why so few gamers have the patience for turn-based games anymore. Adventure games are a dying breed too because it takes half a mind to solve mild logic puzzles. In other words, many "gamers" today are suffering from a terminal case of laziness and stupidity, which also happens to be why voice acting has become the expected standard even in RPGs because it's.... such.... a struggle.... to... read... now.

I wouldn't describe dumbing games down as "evolving into better ones". SF Neo is a different and simpler breed of game, not a step up from previous Force games. Don't ever make the mistake of thinking otherwise; SF Neo is nowhere near as deep.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Mon Oct 31 2005 1:34am
by Tortie
Casper Rogue @ Sun Oct 30, 2005 2:08 pm) wrote:The simple fact that Sega continued the Shining Stories should say something about how much potential they think the series has. So what it isn't a turn-based strategy.

Shining Force that isn't a srpg? Stupid, stupid, stupid move. Depressed and pissed me off for numerous reasons. No sale.

Is the game good? That would be the point.


How good the game is has never been the point, to a good number of us anyway. How you could even BE here and come away without noticing that? It's only been stated about a hundred times.

Other RPGs have evolved into better ones and I dont see people whining about that.


Better means totally different genre now, does it? Funny, I thought fair, balanced reviewers only judged games against titles OF THE SAME GENRE to determine which has better gameplay. Does that tell you anything? That perhaps you're not being as objective as you want us to be?

I also don't believe you're statement about people not whining. For the love of God, this is the INTERNET. Give some examples of "better" games and I'm sure I'll be able to track some whining down for you in a matter of minutes. People whine about everything, you know, kind of like how you are now.

What is wrong with you all? Get over yourself and just pick up a copy to see if it's worth your time or not.


I've already decided not to, and you know what? I really don't care what you think of that.

Then complain about it if it sucks.


Oh, will I be allowed to then, master? :lol:

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Mon Oct 31 2005 1:40am
by Crystalgate
I think Minos hit the nail on it's head or however the saying goes. His advise is good for almost every gamer as opposed to "buy it", which is only good for those who ends up liking the game, or "don't buy it" which is only good for those who would not like the game had they bought it. That should cover the question asked in the topic title quite nicely.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Mon Oct 31 2005 2:20am
by Minos
An incentive to buy : The game feels a lot like Secret of Mana.
Simpler battle system, more epic story and all around feeling.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Mon Oct 31 2005 5:17am
by mad_cat_42
Just to throw in my two cents, I'll repost two things I put in another topic.

Chances are Neo is actually a good game. But I cannot even look at it without thinking of SEGA's idiocy. It is one five-letter word in the title that will ruin the experience for me if I try to play it. And the worst thing is, the Neo in the title indicates that this is the new breed of "Shining Force" and that we won't get another tactical RPG from SEGA again.

SFNeo could be game of the year. It won't matter to me because if I decide to play it, I know I will constantly be reminded that this is SEGA turning its back on the fans. That is what will kill any fun I could have with SFN. And why play video games if not to have fun?

I am not judging SFN based on how good it is as a game. I am judging it based on what it represents and that is the absoute loss of any credibility SEGA may have had before.


Now bash those posts. I dare you.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Mon Oct 31 2005 3:41pm
by Balbaroy
I bought it. And if they continue the series as Neo, I will continue to buy them. I'm in a minority, and I know Geoffrey Duke will soil himself when i say I hope this series takes off and makes a crapload for Sega and Neverland. This may fuel Sega to work on other Shining Force titles. I never took well to Shining Tears or Shining Soul, but NEO I like.

Nowhere does it say that Sega can run only one series of Shining Forces at a time. I hope that a new tactical Shining Force is on the horizon, but if it isn't, we can not do anything about it. The way I see it, by supporting this title, we'll have Shining Force in some shape, rather than not at all.

I like the game for what it is. I'm not comparing the game to the Shining Force of old because they aren't at all the same. Aside from Max, Cain and Adam, there's nothing much that links this game to the original series from what I see. But as a stand alone game it rules.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Nov 02 2005 1:04am
by mad_cat_42
Balbaroy, you're talking about the same company that gave a hedgehog a gun for the first time in it's history. For SEGA, the only thing that matters to them is making as much money as quickly as possible. That is why, if Neo does well, they will continue to make action RPGs. Caring about what the real fans want doesn't make enough money for them as backstabbing the fans and hacking up one of their premiere series'.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Nov 02 2005 3:41am
by Marky
Balbaroy @ Mon Oct 31, 2005 3:41 pm) wrote: I like the game for what it is. I'm not comparing the game to the Shining Force of old because they aren't at all the same. Aside from Max, Cain and Adam, there's nothing much that links this game to the original series from what I see. But as a stand alone game it rules.

I just think the 3 names are the same, and nothing else. Although Max and Cain are part of a "Force" Squad, and that Adam appears a little like the old-school Adam, I doubt SFN has any link at all. I think Sega is just pulling substances out of hot air and hoping it will make a good story (maybe even continue with a sequel-something I hope will not happen b/c I am not in favor of SFN).

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Nov 02 2005 7:06am
by Shankmasterslade
Ok i have a question is this game a two player game?

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Nov 02 2005 11:07am
by Balbaroy
Nope. 1 player only... it would be cool if it had that option... but its only 1P.

I know what you mean Marky.. the more I play it the farther I see it from the SF storyline and crap. i gave it a legitimate shot, which is more than most of us were willing to do.

Mad Cat is right. When you put it like that.. It is despicable. But I do not regret buying the game because it is a lot of fun. its just not what I wanted from a Shining Force title. I like the game, but it is not a SF game. It never will be.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Nov 02 2005 6:31pm
by Marky
Balbaroy @ Wed Nov 02, 2005 11:07 am) wrote: Nope. 1 player only... it would be cool if it had that option... but its only 1P.

I know what you mean Marky.. the more I play it the farther I see it from the SF storyline and crap. i gave it a legitimate shot, which is more than most of us were willing to do.

Mad Cat is right. When you put it like that.. It is despicable. But I do not regret buying the game because it is a lot of fun. its just not what I wanted from a Shining Force title. I like the game, but it is not a SF game. It never will be.

Yep, I gave SFN a shot too. Played for a few hours, and I didn't like it at all. What was a bit annoying was that somebody on these boards really believe that SFN is a real link to SF: ROTDD/SF:LOGI because of a few same names.

I think tomorrow or Friday, the buyer will receive my SFN.

At least you're honest about the game, and you have reasons to like and dislike it. As for me, after those few hours, enough was enough. I should have chopped off my hands or plucked out my eyes instead of playing it.

I think what it boils down to is whether you just like these "Diablo" type clones or not. I am not a big fan of them (my conclusion), and the only reason I gave it a try to was because SFN was my 1st experience with a Diablo Clone, and it had the "Shining" title. But heh, I'm beginning to distance myself from both genres, especially if the "Shining"-ness isn't shining all that much anymore.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Nov 02 2005 8:41pm
by Minos
Marky @ Wed Nov 02, 2005 6:31 pm) wrote: What was a bit annoying was that somebody on these boards really believe that SFN is a real link to SF: ROTDD/SF:LOGI because of a few same names.

And the Shining Lore, and the geography.

Would you care to state why NEO doesn't have a link to Shining Force?

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Nov 02 2005 9:09pm
by Marky
Minos @ Wed Nov 02, 2005 8:41 pm) wrote: And the Shining Lore, and the geography.

Would you care to state why NEO doesn't have a link to Shining Force?

Well, I should have used "direct" or "proper connections" instead of "real link". SFN just doesn't have that proper link. But then again, if there is any link, it is very very weak. As for gameplay in comparison to traditional "Force" games, it does not have any real strategy or a strong story seen in previous Shining. SFN and the new era of Shining Games are not what they used to be.

As for the "Shining Lore", please explain. The lore (1.-Accumulated facts, traditions, or beliefs about a particular subject; 2.-Knowledge acquired through education or experience; 3- Material taught or learned), if any, isn't really Shiny at all.

Geography? So they might be living in a land called Rune. So what? Nearly all Shining games take place in a country called Rune. But that doesn't mean SFN has any real/direct connections with previous Shining Games. Shining Force 3 was in Rune, basically, but at least it centered on Ark Hill (from SF2) and expanded the story from SF2.

SFN really doesn't do anything for the Shining geography. And again, I'll reiterate. Neverland/Sega is trying too hard to force SFN into the Shining World.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Nov 02 2005 9:49pm
by Minos
What would be a proper link? Reaccuring caracters, familiar geography, historical coherency? Well shit, NEO has all three.

No doubt, the gameplay is different from Shining Force 1, 2 and 3. But it's gameplay is very close to that of Shining Wisdom. Even though, gameplay has nothing to do with the brand, obviously. We're not argueing that it's a Shining SRPG or not, we're talking about how it fits into the Shining line of games.

As for story, Shining Force 1 didn't have a very elaborate story, full of holes and lead ins, which ROTDD took advantage of, and NEO follows ROTDD. It's probably the main source material that Neverland examined to make the game follow the story. What should they have done in NEO? Mentionned Dark Dragon or Volcanon? Even if it has nothing to do with the task at hand?

Shining Lore : Medievil, centaurs, cantauls, wolfmen, etc. Basically, the Shining adaptation of the medievil fantasy standard.

The geography in NEO is same one that's featured in every other Shining game. It's obvious. They don't need to travel through Runefaust or Parmacia for the geography to be correctly linked, THAT would feel tacked on and useless.

SFN really doesn't do anything for the Shining geography. And again, I'll reiterate. Neverland/Sega is trying too hard to force SFN into the Shining World.


They aren't trying at all. That's the thing. They made a few links to the Shining story here and there and that's enough. They anchored NEO into the story and went on with the story they wanted to tell.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Thu Nov 03 2005 1:36am
by Marky
Minos @ Wed Nov 02, 2005 9:49 pm) wrote: What would be a proper link? Reaccuring caracters, familiar geography, historical coherency? Well shit, NEO has all three.

No doubt, the gameplay is different from Shining Force 1, 2 and 3. But it's gameplay is very close to that of Shining Wisdom. Even though, gameplay has nothing to do with the brand, obviously. We're not argueing that it's a Shining SRPG or not, we're talking about how it fits into the Shining line of games.

As for story, Shining Force 1 didn't have a very elaborate story, full of holes and lead ins, which ROTDD took advantage of, and NEO follows ROTDD. It's probably the main source material that Neverland examined to make the game follow the story. What should they have done in NEO? Mentionned Dark Dragon or Volcanon? Even if it has nothing to do with the task at hand?

Shining Lore : Medievil, centaurs, cantauls, wolfmen, etc. Basically, the Shining adaptation of the medievil fantasy standard.

The geography in NEO is same one that's featured in every other Shining game. It's obvious. They don't need to travel through Runefaust or Parmacia for the geography to be correctly linked, THAT would feel tacked on and useless.



They aren't trying at all. That's the thing. They made a few links to the Shining story here and there and that's enough. They anchored NEO into the story and went on with the story they wanted to tell.

Oh, ok. By Shining Lore, you meant that.

But for geography, I still doubt it is. Are they really on Rune? I don't know where you are in the game, so I wouldn't know. In the intro and early few hours, they don't say. It could have been in the instructions manual, but I didn't bother reading it.



And still, by saying that Max and Cain are the same two, and saying that droid is Adam (maybe his name is Adam-don't remember because I didn't bother finishing this), that does not mean these are the same characters as you believe them to be. If anybody finishes the game, and Max and Cain winds up going into eternal sleep in some cryogenic chamber, then you can conclude that these two are the same. But that is still not possible, because if you remember in ROTDD, the Ancients (or scientists who made the satellites so you can cast magic) made DD, and had Max and his brother Cain sleep for a while to fight DD if he were to awaken. In SFN, Max knows who he is; he didn't awaken from some slumber or come from a mysterious land (in ROTDD, that mysterious land was Prompt b/c the cryogenic chamber is under that castle). And Shining Force Neo can't take place after ROTDD/LOGI because Kane/Cain is dead, remember? Darksol killed him. If anything, it's just a reuse of character names and a little of appearance. They are not the same characters.

The only thing that would make this Shining at all was the centaurs, swordplay, magic etc. But that's it.



PS: Geography wise, where are they really? And you know, the more you think about it and the other games anybody tries to link SFN to, you find more holes and inconsistencies that do not connect to ROTDD or any other Shining game.

By the way, Neo isn't my cup of tea. I will end my stand on Neo with that. Yours is different, and that's your opinion too.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sun Nov 06 2005 8:58am
by Legend of Josh
Tonight, I actually purchased Shining Force Neo. I read all the horrible reviews, from many different sources, and being the fan I am, I ventured to buy this one no matter the outcome.

To my surprise, I like the game. Sure, it's not a "classic" by any stretch of the imagination, but it's a hell of a lot better than I originally expected it to be. There are some positives, and negatives. I played for 3 good hours, and I'm "hooked" I guess you could say.

At first, I didn't enjoy the arcade style, but I already knew the game was going to be that way. Usually, with arcade style type games, there's not much of a storyline, but here, I don't mind the storyline, in fact, I like the storyline; thus far anyway. I can't wait to pick up some more characters. I know you really can't experience this game the same way you can other great Shining Force titles, but this is something new and different. Maybe not for the best, but we can at least try and enjoy it for what it is.

The hack-and-slash style can get repetitive, which is what I thought would happen after about 15 minutes, but it really doesn't bother me, surprisingly. The motionless face analog is lame, but I'm starting to get used to it, maybe even like it.

I think I'll get my $'s worth from Shining Force Neo. To a degree, my favortism or being biased is allowing me to think highly of this game. If this was labeled something else, maybe I wouldn't enjoy it as much, but I don't think this game is a complete waste like many others have proclaimed.

Not a classic from SEGA, just something a Shining Force fan should own, I guess.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Nov 09 2005 5:12am
by Jup
BUY..i bought and im satisfied with it!

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Nov 16 2005 2:59pm
by Legend of Josh
This game is turning into one of my favorite games. Greatly impressed. The storyline is really, really good.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Nov 16 2005 6:52pm
by LunarMaster
Links between Shining Force and Shining Force Neo:
WARNING: SPOILER!


They would need to further expand on Shining Force Neo (perhaps in a sequal) to directly connect it to Shining Force, but the plots do agree with one another.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sat Nov 19 2005 8:19am
by acri
hmmm i have a lot of friends telling me this game is not up to the standard(i have a lot of friends who love sf series since 1). Being tied up by exams recently, i cant really play it but so far comments by them are not good... making me kinda dread playing this game now O_O

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Mon Nov 21 2005 2:47pm
by Legend of Josh
hmmm i have a lot of friends telling me this game is not up to the standard(i have a lot of friends who love sf series since 1). Being tied up by exams recently, i cant really play it but so far comments by them are not good... making me kinda dread playing this game now O_O


If you're looking for a true "Shining" game, you should probably stay away. That is unless you're approaching Neo with an open mind. There's a good chance you will not enjoy Neo if you're only expecting a flawless game up to par with previous Shining releases.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Fri Dec 02 2005 7:56am
by Aspartate
Links? Agree? Wow such fraud Sega put up.

Sega of Japan officially announced that Neo is NOT linked to the original Shining Force on Genesis nor the SF remake on GBA. Hard to believe? Check out the FAQ section of Neo's official site. Scroll to the last Q&A, dump it in this translation site, and there you have it:
[Question] Since many characters share the same name, is there any relationship between "Shining Force" of Genesis & GBA and this game?
[Answer] It is not directly related in story. It is homage to the past "Shining Force". And if it gives a smile only to those who understands, it will make me glad.

I thought it's dirty enough for SoJ to deliberately misled people to think this is a prequel to the original.
(This FAQ was added 5 days after the game's release. By the time people found they were cheated and wanted to complain, SoJ can point to this page and say, "told you so. You weren't paying attention to our announcements. :p")
But at least they admitted it. SoA just chose to make no clarification on this. Geez.

[SIZE=1][edit]Figured I should add the translation to the question too to avoid confusion

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Fri Dec 02 2005 3:21pm
by Cullsoft
So is that an admittance that technically this isn't a Shining game? :biggrin:

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Fri Dec 02 2005 5:29pm
by Legend of Josh
I don't think SEGA intended to "trick" people into buying this game under the impression it would be just like previous releases. I think they intended to label it "Shining" for boosted profits. Yes, it is deceiving, but people should read labels or do research before they spend $50 on something, video game or anything else.

If you bought Neo and now you're unhappy because you feel you were under a false impression, maybe this will be a lesson to you.

:thumbsup:

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Fri Dec 02 2005 6:32pm
by Cullsoft
Legend of Josh @ Fri Dec 02, 2005 4:29 pm) wrote: I don't think SEGA intended to "trick" people into buying this game under the impression it would be just like previous releases. I think they intended to label it "Shining" for boosted profits.

So they always meant to buttrape the series for their own good at the expense of the fans who cared? Despite the fact that we were a factor in the reasons for reviving Shining games?

Remind me to visit SoJ's headquarters while next March. Bearing in mind I can find a petrol station first.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Fri Dec 02 2005 7:31pm
by Tarethen
Cullsoft @ Fri Dec 02, 2005 12:32 pm) wrote: So they always meant to buttrape the series for their own good at the expense of the fans who cared? Despite the fact that we were a factor in the reasons for reviving Shining games?

Remind me to visit SoJ's headquarters while next March. Bearing in mind I can find a petrol station first.

Well... Sega is a company out to make money. If it outrages a few fans, I doubt they care much. It's all about making money, not necessarily pleasing their fans.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Fri Dec 02 2005 8:47pm
by Jogurt821
That's been Sega's plan after the deconnection of the Dreamcast.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Thu Dec 15 2005 4:42am
by Marky
Aspartate @ Fri Dec 02, 2005 7:56 am) wrote: Links? Agree? Wow such fraud Sega put up.

Sega of Japan officially announced that Neo is NOT linked to the original Shining Force on Genesis nor the SF remake on GBA. Hard to believe? Check out the FAQ section of Neo's official site. Scroll to the last Q&A, dump it in this translation site, and there you have it:
[Question] Since many characters share the same name, is there any relationship between "Shining Force" of Genesis & GBA and this game?
[Answer] It is not directly related in story. It is homage to the past "Shining Force". And if it gives a smile only to those who understands, it will make me glad.

I thought it's dirty enough for SoJ to deliberately misled people to think this is a prequel to the original.
(This FAQ was added 5 days after the game's release. By the time people found they were cheated and wanted to complain, SoJ can point to this page and say, "told you so. You weren't paying attention to our announcements. :p")
But at least they admitted it. SoA just chose to make no clarification on this. Geez.

[SIZE=1][edit]Figured I should add the translation to the question too to avoid confusion

Yep, I figured it was just a game to present SF: LOGI and SF:ROTDD in a strange but unrelated way.

Yay! I was correct for once! Anyway, thanks, Aspartate, for clarifying where SFN stands in the Shining World.

I guess SFN isn't a Shining game at all.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Jan 04 2006 12:22am
by Noahd42
the Shining Force series ended on a good note dont you think? three successful games all on Sega consoles. This is the first origional Shining Force game on a non Sega console, times have changed and so has the gameplay(If you really liked the strategic gameplay you can relive SF on the GBA). I too favor the strategic turn based play over real time, but the game still features many memorable characters, beautiful and diverse environments and the classic battle between light and evil like the other Shining Force games.....the main characters name is Max just like the origional SF! They tried to make this game as Shining Force as possible while still keeping it into its own unique series. Support Sega by buying this game, it is a good move in the right direction but if you dont like the direction that the series is taking after playing the game and giving it some quality time pawn it off or something and voice your complaints or you will never be heard. Basically just give it a chance, times have changed...who knows it might grow on you.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Thu Jan 05 2006 1:40am
by Marky
Noahd42 @ Wed Jan 04, 2006 12:22 am) wrote: the Shining Force series ended on a good note dont you think? three successful games all on Sega consoles. This is the first origional Shining Force game on a non Sega console, times have changed and so has the gameplay(If you really liked the strategic gameplay you can relive SF on the GBA). I too favor the strategic turn based play over real time, but the game still features many memorable characters, beautiful and diverse environments and the classic battle between light and evil like the other Shining Force games.....the main characters name is Max just like the origional SF! They tried to make this game as Shining Force as possible while still keeping it into its own unique series. Support Sega by buying this game, it is a good move in the right direction but if you dont like the direction that the series is taking after playing the game and giving it some quality time pawn it off or something and voice your complaints or you will never be heard. Basically just give it a chance, times have changed...who knows it might grow on you.

Well, yes, Shining Force ended on a good note on a Sega Console. But now, SF has been resurrected as a Zombie. And asking us to purchase this game (to give it a try or to support Sega and encourage them to make another SF game), well, it won't happen. I purchased Neo, played a few hours, said f**k it. I didn't like it and sold to somebody on the boards.

And by purchasing this game, you might be encouraging Sega to make another hack 'N slash SF game. So I wouldn't buy another Diablo clone from Sega, even if it is SF unless it was good. SFN in my opinion wasn't all that great.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Fri Jan 06 2006 8:13am
by Chaos Wizard
There are defenately things in Neo that are taken from the Shining Series. But it's not connected directly to the rest of the series, thus why it is named Neo.

Reguardless of the fact it is not Shining Force 1, 2, 3, or the fabled 4 everyone here wants to see. The game is fun as hell, the storyline is not bad at all. The movies are wicked, and there is a lot of replay value. It's a game that gamers into storylines , traveling fantasy, hack n slashers, or just something to kill time can play and enjoy. Although its not Shining Force, I have enjoyed the references to the old games in Neo. All and All. It's not Force, but it's still a decent game.

Personally I think that the people totally flipping out on Neo take this shit a little too seriously. I love the series. It remains to be my favorite series. From the day I bought SitD in '91 before there was any kind of series to this present day. Neo doesn't bother me at all. I was less amused by Shining Wisdom, Shining Soul, and Shining Tears then I am with Shining Force Neo.

If your a total purist don't get it. But if you are looking for a cool RPG to play for a while and aren't totally stuck on the fact it's not Shining Force 4. Buy it.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Fri Jan 06 2006 8:49pm
by Noahd42
By saying Shining Force Neo is an anime-laden Diablo clone is like saying Silent Hill is a Resident Evil clone just because the two are of the same genre or Killzone is a Halo clone because they are both FPS games.... or Rez is a Panzer Dragoon clone because they are both rail shooters....
The point is that the gameplay is solid either way you see it, i cant draw too many similarities between Diablo and SF NEO...other than that Diablo was garbage... SF Neo just is a different take using slight similarities in gameplay.
I'm really glad they got a big name studio to do the anime cutscenes, because i really dont think the in-game engine could have handled those cutscenes as well as the anime did.
I'm enjoying the game, but its definitley a game you have to let yourself get into and put in 3-5 hours before you judge it, its not at the top of my gaming list right now, but its definitley up there and will be completed...

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sat Jan 07 2006 12:33am
by Marky
Noahd42 @ Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:49 pm) wrote: By saying Shining Force Neo is an anime-laden Diablo clone is like saying Silent Hill is a Resident Evil clone just because the two are of the same genre or Killzone is a Halo clone because they are both FPS games.... or Rez is a Panzer Dragoon clone because they are both rail shooters....
The point is that the gameplay is solid either way you see it, i cant draw too many similarities between Diablo and SF NEO...other than that Diablo was garbage... SF Neo just is a different take using slight similarities in gameplay.
I'm really glad they got a big name studio to do the anime cutscenes, because i really dont think the in-game engine could have handled those cutscenes as well as the anime did.
I'm enjoying the game, but its definitley a game you have to let yourself get into and put in 3-5 hours before you judge it, its not at the top of my gaming list right now, but its definitley up there and will be completed...

I gave it rouglhy 3 hours, and I didn't enjoy it. So I guess my opinion is valid. And I gave it a try too (as mentioned in other posts).

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sat Jan 07 2006 9:46am
by Noahd42
fair enough, hopefully you will be treated with a game you like in the near future from the Shining series.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sat Jan 07 2006 2:23pm
by Wyndigo
Hotstuffcomingyourway!Hotstuffcomingyourway!Hotstuffcomingyourway!Hotstuffcomingyourway!Hotstuffcomingyourway!Hotstuffcomingyourway!..... Times infinity.

Yeah. No. It just doesn't look like the type of game to give a lot of replay. The voice acting sounds pretty bad and from what I've heard the story is kinda mudane. No, I'm not gonna buy it.

I might rent it though if I'm that curious.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sat Jan 07 2006 2:51pm
by Tarethen
Voices grow on you. I'm used to Max's voice now. Mariel's voice is also done well.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sat Jan 07 2006 6:22pm
by Fox
Yeah at the start Meryl irritated the hell out of me. But I'll admit, I actually started to like her voice after awhile... and Graham is just funny.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sat Jan 07 2006 10:39pm
by Noahd42
i agree, the voice acting early on it pretty weak
it gets better as more characters are introduced i think.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Thu Aug 24 2006 7:22pm
by pLuShIe
Bought it, disliked it, took another look into it.. and fell in love :3

Sadly, it's the first SF game I have played, but reading a lot of disappointed posts coming from the old school fans, I may have to go look into them all.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sat Dec 16 2006 4:03am
by Shining Bowie
Just bought this yesterday and am about to load it in my ps2 now.

I will edit this post with my initial thoughts.

EDIT:

I think this is a better game than the souls... though just and advanced version of them. It makes me want to find Shining Tears.. I stumbled across this with some dumb luck at the EB games PREPLAYED section.

I do find the talking to be really really excessively long.

And I'm finding the battles to be very difficult... though O mashing....

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Dec 27 2006 9:12pm
by Millefune
Just thought I'd chime in on the "sales/boycott" angle of the thread. The sales in the U.S. really won't affect what direction they go in, just whether or not they port the next ones over. It's the sales in Japan that'll influence the series' game mechanic/style trend. The game is made and developed in Japan after all.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Jan 03 2007 3:28pm
by Geoffrey Duke
Millefune @ Wed Dec 27, 2006 9:12 pm) wrote: Just thought I'd chime in on the "sales/boycott" angle of the thread. The sales in the U.S. really won't affect what direction they go in, just whether or not they port the next ones over. It's the sales in Japan that'll influence the series' game mechanic/style trend. The game is made and developed in Japan after all.

Uh-huh.

You do realise that Japan has become one of the smallest markets for games now, right?

Sega of America have already translated SF Exa despite Neo crashing on the launch pad because they aren't currently thinking in terms of brand recognition.

They are thinking in terms of trends, and trends tell us that non-restrictive non-turn-based "RPGs" are all the rage. SoA has/have gone through some sort of an identity crisis whereby their ideal business direction is to follow the leader.

I have to give them some credit though for buying up the rights to the Aliens franchise, and publishing a new Aliens RPG developed by Obsidian, but again, Sega is/are just foreseeing yet another trend (the rising popularity of sci-fi RPGs and action games).

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Jan 03 2007 7:43pm
by Eric
Neo means something to everyone here. Neo essentially means "new". And to me that means new series, new games, new makers and yes, new fans and new consumers. Which means I am not part of that equation. As far as I am concerned Shining Tears was the last game made in the series. I stayed strong with Shining games even through the Soul games and I enjoyed RotDD. I don't care if they remake SF2 or 3 right now, they already sealed the coffin as GD says. I can not take any more game to be a part of the series. Shining Road 1 was in development at that time, and I am somehwat interested in that. But SR2 and SWind. Wrong guy. I don't care if they make Max using guns or some other ballogne in the future. It's over, its shot.

Now with that said I thought the gameplay looked pretty good, but there are plenty of other games I would rather buy. I simply cannot support a series that sold out the people that made it a series, not just the makers, but the consumers.

They can go make a SF football game and some of you will still buy it.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Jan 03 2007 8:02pm
by Geoffrey Duke
I just read through my older posts in this topic (some which were written over a year ago), and actually regret that everything I predicted came true.

People supported Neo, so naturally, Sega made another game just like it.

Never saw that one coming!

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Jan 03 2007 9:26pm
by Tarethen
So obviously everyone who was a fan of the old Shining games, and continue to buy the new games (very small population, mind you), are essentially part of the problem?

Interesting logic.

Going back and forth about how Sega killed the Shining series isn't going to accomplish anything. It's not the first series Sega screwed up, and it definitely won't be the last.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Jan 03 2007 10:58pm
by Geoffrey Duke
When you bought Neo, you basically killed Shining Force.

Thanks.

I'm actually starting not to care anymore tbh. I have quite a long list of other games I need to play now without worrying about the bastard children of the Shining brandname.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Jan 03 2007 11:14pm
by Tarethen
Oh look at me, I hammered a nail in a coffin. Oh look, I'll do it again in March.

Honestly, if you're blaming Shining fans for Sega's current state of mind, then you might as well blame those who purchased all of the new Sonic games and new Phantasy Star games. They all deviated from their roots, and people continued to buy them and play them. It's not just the Shining series. Jesus.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Wed Jan 03 2007 11:22pm
by Inactive account
I vote buy

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Tue Jan 30 2007 6:05pm
by j4rose
I haven't voted yet because I'm not sure. I've seen several shots and it looks kind of cool, if not as good as a traditional SF game.

I don't like the fact that other characters in the group aren't playable characters in the truest sense. That really puts me off. How much control do you have over them? I also live in the UK. I have a universal PS2, so I can play American games, but I can't seem to find the game anywhere and don't know where to look (or if I should bother).

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Fri Feb 02 2007 1:56am
by Marky
Well, I have seen a few copies of Shining Force Neo in a few game stores. They go from $29.99~$39.99 nowadays. The price is for a new game too.

Second, I wouldn't recommend the game though. You might want to rent the game. If you like it, buy it. If you don't, then you don't need to purchase it. I made the mistake of "giving" Sega a chance and purchased the game the day it came out. I didn't like it, so I sold it. Fair and simple.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Mon Mar 19 2007 6:22am
by Slayer07
i rented it, didnt like it, and im only out 5 bucks

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Tue Apr 03 2007 1:48pm
by ShiningLover
Hi. Im new in these topics of shining force neo. I bought it a last week on ebay and the game should arrive in any minute. So, i thought of taking a look around in shining force neo forums and see what you guys think about the game, and what do i saw? Many people dissapointed with the game. I saw some screenshots of the game and it looked pretty awsome!! I also saw some of the new shining force exa and i got impressed with it too. Why do you dislike the game ? Yes, its not the tactical type like shining force 3 for example(my favorite), but i got my theory about why sega didn't or dosen't want to make a tactical shining game: because its a lot of work to do. I played shining force 3 many times and i think making a good story for a game like this its very hard to do i guess. I played also other RPGs like Dragon force, shining the holy ark, FF7, FF9, FF10, and others, and let me tell you: Shining force 3 story, in my opinion, IS THE BEST.
I also wish that a new shining force (4) could came up some day. THAT WOULD BE GREAT! :thumbsup:


WAIT A MINUTE...no more Vandals, no more innovators?!?!! (now it came to my mind) So...who's the enemy now? I really thought i was gonna see Galm and Elise once again. So naive of me. It just came to my knowlodge now that Sonic and Camelot were not part of these new series of shining force. That explains it all.
But just like i said before, keep your minds open to the new shining series.
Im gonna play it and see for my self what the game is like.

:excited: I LOVE SHINING FORCE CENTRAL. :excited:

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sun May 20 2007 3:32am
by knifelord
Shining Force Neo is a really cool game but I still haven't gotten really hooked on it yet. My brother is pretty far into the game and he's hooked so I probably will be soon too.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Mon Jun 25 2007 9:59am
by cheesemaster
After years of hard-core s*ny (ha, I haven't censored that word in many years) hatred, I eventually caved in and bought one when my roommate moved and took Katamari Damacy. I still only have a few games for the thing, but I decided to pick up this game for various questionable reasons. Apparently my PS2 hates it, because it somehow scratched (burned?) a big swath of destruction into the game disc, and it doesn't work. It's done the same thing with a few DVDs, but not to any of my other games. I guess that's what I get for buying a used PS2. Or for buying one at all. But still, I didn't hate this game when I was able to play it, and I'm just going to assume they forgot to make an ending to it so I don't feel bad about not being able to finish it. True story.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Fri Apr 24 2009 3:52am
by Crimson_Blade
This game is an atrocity to the shining force series IMO. They should have never strayed from the original idea of shining games being strategy RPGs.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Fri Apr 24 2009 3:59am
by Martin III
Crimson_Blade @ Fri Apr 24, 2009 3:52 am) wrote: This game is an atrocity to the shining force series IMO. They should have never strayed from the original idea of shining games being strategy RPGs.

:confused: The original idea was for them to be 1st person dungeon crawlers.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Mon May 04 2009 8:32pm
by Crimson_Blade
Geoffrey Duke @ Sun Jul 10, 2005 8:02 pm) wrote: If you buy this game, you are showing your support for the direction Sega has taken the series in, and that will only encourage Sega to turn it into a series. That's how the games industry operates. If Shining Force Neo sells well, Sega isn't going to make another "Shining Force" game that doesn't having the same "winning formula". Once SF Neo entrenches itself, Sega will simply expand on that foothold (brand recognition) with more of the same money making gameplay.

For that reason alone I ask fans of the series to boycott Shining Force Neo regardless of however good it might be. Show your support for Strategy/RPGs by buying Fire Emblem for the GameCube instead.

This game suxxorz, buy if you dare, and yeah I agree with most everything you said, sega needs to dish out more strategy/RPG genre Shining games.

Personally, I starting Shining games with Shining Force , then Shining Force 2, which set the expectations of the rest of the shining games to a very high level, and the non-strategy RPG ones I have played just don't even come close to measuring up. I would even settle for a remake of Shining force 3 scenarios, maybe with some enhanced graphics etc, few new characters, no Mawlock and in English. The best Shining games are the strategy RPG ones, I am sure most people here would agree.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Sun Jun 28 2009 1:48pm
by swordandshield
I really got into Shining Force Neo, I don't understand why you guys can't like it because it's different than the others and nit pick it so much. I admit I like the turn based strategic battles better, loads better in fact. They are more engaging and just overall more fitting for my taste in RPGs but it's no reason to completely dismiss the game and not even give it a chance or say that it's horrible. It's still worth playing a disappointment or not because there's plenty of great features that it has that is exclusive to itself and I happen to like the change in the battle system, it's pretty refreshing and it's always a pleasure to try something new, even if the hack n' slash genre isn't new but it's new to the Shining Force series. It has things it excels at and things it doesn't excel at but it still has the old Shining Force feel to it and it can still be fun if you take the time to enjoy it instead of wishing it was like the older ones.

The characters were pretty likeable and engaging and so was the story, it had some exciting combat full of action, it may not have been as good as strategy but it wasn't boring by any stretch of the imagination and you still needed strategy for some battles like the legion hives. It wasn't no walk in sesame street, it had a great deal of difficulty which I like games with a lot of challenge. The graphics were pretty top notch for PS2 as well, the envioroments were beautiful rendered in 3D and they were very colorful. The sound track was also top notch with each theme fitting correspondingly to the scenes, battles, and areas that you were in. Also the way you customized your characters with the scrolls was a nice addition and customizing Max however you wanted was great. The versatility about it was a nice thing to add because you could change from a mage class to a warrior/melee class at will to better your advantage on certain enemies.

Really, what is there not to like. I wouldn't mind if they came out with another Shining Force just like it. I do hope for another strategy one but I'm not going to throw a fit over it. There's other strategy games out there.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Mon Jun 29 2009 3:02am
by Martin III
swordandshield @ Sun Jun 28, 2009 1:48 pm) wrote: Really, what is there not to like. I wouldn't mind if they came out with another Shining Force just like it.

They already did: Shining Force Exa.

EDIT: Deleted the rest of my spiel after discovering in the SF Exa forum that you're already familiar with the game.

Re: To buy or not to buy?

PostPosted: Fri Jul 03 2009 3:46pm
by swordandshield
I am familiar with Exa. I was referring to another game that was like it and Neo that Sega could develope but I hope there would be different areas and not always use the same ones. I think that's one of their biggest downfalls.

If they made it like Secret of Mana it would be much better.