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To buy or not to buy?

Discuss Sega's Shining 'Force' RPG for the S*ny Playstation 2.

To buy or not to buy?

yes
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64%
no
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Total votes : 88

Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby Tortie » Mon Oct 31 2005 1:34am

Casper Rogue @ Sun Oct 30, 2005 2:08 pm) wrote:The simple fact that Sega continued the Shining Stories should say something about how much potential they think the series has. So what it isn't a turn-based strategy.

Shining Force that isn't a srpg? Stupid, stupid, stupid move. Depressed and pissed me off for numerous reasons. No sale.

Is the game good? That would be the point.


How good the game is has never been the point, to a good number of us anyway. How you could even BE here and come away without noticing that? It's only been stated about a hundred times.

Other RPGs have evolved into better ones and I dont see people whining about that.


Better means totally different genre now, does it? Funny, I thought fair, balanced reviewers only judged games against titles OF THE SAME GENRE to determine which has better gameplay. Does that tell you anything? That perhaps you're not being as objective as you want us to be?

I also don't believe you're statement about people not whining. For the love of God, this is the INTERNET. Give some examples of "better" games and I'm sure I'll be able to track some whining down for you in a matter of minutes. People whine about everything, you know, kind of like how you are now.

What is wrong with you all? Get over yourself and just pick up a copy to see if it's worth your time or not.


I've already decided not to, and you know what? I really don't care what you think of that.

Then complain about it if it sucks.


Oh, will I be allowed to then, master? :lol:
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby Crystalgate » Mon Oct 31 2005 1:40am

I think Minos hit the nail on it's head or however the saying goes. His advise is good for almost every gamer as opposed to "buy it", which is only good for those who ends up liking the game, or "don't buy it" which is only good for those who would not like the game had they bought it. That should cover the question asked in the topic title quite nicely.
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby Minos » Mon Oct 31 2005 2:20am

An incentive to buy : The game feels a lot like Secret of Mana.
Simpler battle system, more epic story and all around feeling.
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby mad_cat_42 » Mon Oct 31 2005 5:17am

Just to throw in my two cents, I'll repost two things I put in another topic.

Chances are Neo is actually a good game. But I cannot even look at it without thinking of SEGA's idiocy. It is one five-letter word in the title that will ruin the experience for me if I try to play it. And the worst thing is, the Neo in the title indicates that this is the new breed of "Shining Force" and that we won't get another tactical RPG from SEGA again.

SFNeo could be game of the year. It won't matter to me because if I decide to play it, I know I will constantly be reminded that this is SEGA turning its back on the fans. That is what will kill any fun I could have with SFN. And why play video games if not to have fun?

I am not judging SFN based on how good it is as a game. I am judging it based on what it represents and that is the absoute loss of any credibility SEGA may have had before.


Now bash those posts. I dare you.
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby Balbaroy » Mon Oct 31 2005 3:41pm

I bought it. And if they continue the series as Neo, I will continue to buy them. I'm in a minority, and I know Geoffrey Duke will soil himself when i say I hope this series takes off and makes a crapload for Sega and Neverland. This may fuel Sega to work on other Shining Force titles. I never took well to Shining Tears or Shining Soul, but NEO I like.

Nowhere does it say that Sega can run only one series of Shining Forces at a time. I hope that a new tactical Shining Force is on the horizon, but if it isn't, we can not do anything about it. The way I see it, by supporting this title, we'll have Shining Force in some shape, rather than not at all.

I like the game for what it is. I'm not comparing the game to the Shining Force of old because they aren't at all the same. Aside from Max, Cain and Adam, there's nothing much that links this game to the original series from what I see. But as a stand alone game it rules.
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby mad_cat_42 » Wed Nov 02 2005 1:04am

Balbaroy, you're talking about the same company that gave a hedgehog a gun for the first time in it's history. For SEGA, the only thing that matters to them is making as much money as quickly as possible. That is why, if Neo does well, they will continue to make action RPGs. Caring about what the real fans want doesn't make enough money for them as backstabbing the fans and hacking up one of their premiere series'.
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby Marky » Wed Nov 02 2005 3:41am

Balbaroy @ Mon Oct 31, 2005 3:41 pm) wrote: I like the game for what it is. I'm not comparing the game to the Shining Force of old because they aren't at all the same. Aside from Max, Cain and Adam, there's nothing much that links this game to the original series from what I see. But as a stand alone game it rules.

I just think the 3 names are the same, and nothing else. Although Max and Cain are part of a "Force" Squad, and that Adam appears a little like the old-school Adam, I doubt SFN has any link at all. I think Sega is just pulling substances out of hot air and hoping it will make a good story (maybe even continue with a sequel-something I hope will not happen b/c I am not in favor of SFN).
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby Shankmasterslade » Wed Nov 02 2005 7:06am

Ok i have a question is this game a two player game?
 
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby Balbaroy » Wed Nov 02 2005 11:07am

Nope. 1 player only... it would be cool if it had that option... but its only 1P.

I know what you mean Marky.. the more I play it the farther I see it from the SF storyline and crap. i gave it a legitimate shot, which is more than most of us were willing to do.

Mad Cat is right. When you put it like that.. It is despicable. But I do not regret buying the game because it is a lot of fun. its just not what I wanted from a Shining Force title. I like the game, but it is not a SF game. It never will be.
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby Marky » Wed Nov 02 2005 6:31pm

Balbaroy @ Wed Nov 02, 2005 11:07 am) wrote: Nope. 1 player only... it would be cool if it had that option... but its only 1P.

I know what you mean Marky.. the more I play it the farther I see it from the SF storyline and crap. i gave it a legitimate shot, which is more than most of us were willing to do.

Mad Cat is right. When you put it like that.. It is despicable. But I do not regret buying the game because it is a lot of fun. its just not what I wanted from a Shining Force title. I like the game, but it is not a SF game. It never will be.

Yep, I gave SFN a shot too. Played for a few hours, and I didn't like it at all. What was a bit annoying was that somebody on these boards really believe that SFN is a real link to SF: ROTDD/SF:LOGI because of a few same names.

I think tomorrow or Friday, the buyer will receive my SFN.

At least you're honest about the game, and you have reasons to like and dislike it. As for me, after those few hours, enough was enough. I should have chopped off my hands or plucked out my eyes instead of playing it.

I think what it boils down to is whether you just like these "Diablo" type clones or not. I am not a big fan of them (my conclusion), and the only reason I gave it a try to was because SFN was my 1st experience with a Diablo Clone, and it had the "Shining" title. But heh, I'm beginning to distance myself from both genres, especially if the "Shining"-ness isn't shining all that much anymore.
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby Minos » Wed Nov 02 2005 8:41pm

Marky @ Wed Nov 02, 2005 6:31 pm) wrote: What was a bit annoying was that somebody on these boards really believe that SFN is a real link to SF: ROTDD/SF:LOGI because of a few same names.

And the Shining Lore, and the geography.

Would you care to state why NEO doesn't have a link to Shining Force?
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby Marky » Wed Nov 02 2005 9:09pm

Minos @ Wed Nov 02, 2005 8:41 pm) wrote: And the Shining Lore, and the geography.

Would you care to state why NEO doesn't have a link to Shining Force?

Well, I should have used "direct" or "proper connections" instead of "real link". SFN just doesn't have that proper link. But then again, if there is any link, it is very very weak. As for gameplay in comparison to traditional "Force" games, it does not have any real strategy or a strong story seen in previous Shining. SFN and the new era of Shining Games are not what they used to be.

As for the "Shining Lore", please explain. The lore (1.-Accumulated facts, traditions, or beliefs about a particular subject; 2.-Knowledge acquired through education or experience; 3- Material taught or learned), if any, isn't really Shiny at all.

Geography? So they might be living in a land called Rune. So what? Nearly all Shining games take place in a country called Rune. But that doesn't mean SFN has any real/direct connections with previous Shining Games. Shining Force 3 was in Rune, basically, but at least it centered on Ark Hill (from SF2) and expanded the story from SF2.

SFN really doesn't do anything for the Shining geography. And again, I'll reiterate. Neverland/Sega is trying too hard to force SFN into the Shining World.
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby Minos » Wed Nov 02 2005 9:49pm

What would be a proper link? Reaccuring caracters, familiar geography, historical coherency? Well shit, NEO has all three.

No doubt, the gameplay is different from Shining Force 1, 2 and 3. But it's gameplay is very close to that of Shining Wisdom. Even though, gameplay has nothing to do with the brand, obviously. We're not argueing that it's a Shining SRPG or not, we're talking about how it fits into the Shining line of games.

As for story, Shining Force 1 didn't have a very elaborate story, full of holes and lead ins, which ROTDD took advantage of, and NEO follows ROTDD. It's probably the main source material that Neverland examined to make the game follow the story. What should they have done in NEO? Mentionned Dark Dragon or Volcanon? Even if it has nothing to do with the task at hand?

Shining Lore : Medievil, centaurs, cantauls, wolfmen, etc. Basically, the Shining adaptation of the medievil fantasy standard.

The geography in NEO is same one that's featured in every other Shining game. It's obvious. They don't need to travel through Runefaust or Parmacia for the geography to be correctly linked, THAT would feel tacked on and useless.

SFN really doesn't do anything for the Shining geography. And again, I'll reiterate. Neverland/Sega is trying too hard to force SFN into the Shining World.


They aren't trying at all. That's the thing. They made a few links to the Shining story here and there and that's enough. They anchored NEO into the story and went on with the story they wanted to tell.
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby Marky » Thu Nov 03 2005 1:36am

Minos @ Wed Nov 02, 2005 9:49 pm) wrote: What would be a proper link? Reaccuring caracters, familiar geography, historical coherency? Well shit, NEO has all three.

No doubt, the gameplay is different from Shining Force 1, 2 and 3. But it's gameplay is very close to that of Shining Wisdom. Even though, gameplay has nothing to do with the brand, obviously. We're not argueing that it's a Shining SRPG or not, we're talking about how it fits into the Shining line of games.

As for story, Shining Force 1 didn't have a very elaborate story, full of holes and lead ins, which ROTDD took advantage of, and NEO follows ROTDD. It's probably the main source material that Neverland examined to make the game follow the story. What should they have done in NEO? Mentionned Dark Dragon or Volcanon? Even if it has nothing to do with the task at hand?

Shining Lore : Medievil, centaurs, cantauls, wolfmen, etc. Basically, the Shining adaptation of the medievil fantasy standard.

The geography in NEO is same one that's featured in every other Shining game. It's obvious. They don't need to travel through Runefaust or Parmacia for the geography to be correctly linked, THAT would feel tacked on and useless.



They aren't trying at all. That's the thing. They made a few links to the Shining story here and there and that's enough. They anchored NEO into the story and went on with the story they wanted to tell.

Oh, ok. By Shining Lore, you meant that.

But for geography, I still doubt it is. Are they really on Rune? I don't know where you are in the game, so I wouldn't know. In the intro and early few hours, they don't say. It could have been in the instructions manual, but I didn't bother reading it.



And still, by saying that Max and Cain are the same two, and saying that droid is Adam (maybe his name is Adam-don't remember because I didn't bother finishing this), that does not mean these are the same characters as you believe them to be. If anybody finishes the game, and Max and Cain winds up going into eternal sleep in some cryogenic chamber, then you can conclude that these two are the same. But that is still not possible, because if you remember in ROTDD, the Ancients (or scientists who made the satellites so you can cast magic) made DD, and had Max and his brother Cain sleep for a while to fight DD if he were to awaken. In SFN, Max knows who he is; he didn't awaken from some slumber or come from a mysterious land (in ROTDD, that mysterious land was Prompt b/c the cryogenic chamber is under that castle). And Shining Force Neo can't take place after ROTDD/LOGI because Kane/Cain is dead, remember? Darksol killed him. If anything, it's just a reuse of character names and a little of appearance. They are not the same characters.

The only thing that would make this Shining at all was the centaurs, swordplay, magic etc. But that's it.



PS: Geography wise, where are they really? And you know, the more you think about it and the other games anybody tries to link SFN to, you find more holes and inconsistencies that do not connect to ROTDD or any other Shining game.

By the way, Neo isn't my cup of tea. I will end my stand on Neo with that. Yours is different, and that's your opinion too.
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby Legend of Josh » Sun Nov 06 2005 8:58am

Tonight, I actually purchased Shining Force Neo. I read all the horrible reviews, from many different sources, and being the fan I am, I ventured to buy this one no matter the outcome.

To my surprise, I like the game. Sure, it's not a "classic" by any stretch of the imagination, but it's a hell of a lot better than I originally expected it to be. There are some positives, and negatives. I played for 3 good hours, and I'm "hooked" I guess you could say.

At first, I didn't enjoy the arcade style, but I already knew the game was going to be that way. Usually, with arcade style type games, there's not much of a storyline, but here, I don't mind the storyline, in fact, I like the storyline; thus far anyway. I can't wait to pick up some more characters. I know you really can't experience this game the same way you can other great Shining Force titles, but this is something new and different. Maybe not for the best, but we can at least try and enjoy it for what it is.

The hack-and-slash style can get repetitive, which is what I thought would happen after about 15 minutes, but it really doesn't bother me, surprisingly. The motionless face analog is lame, but I'm starting to get used to it, maybe even like it.

I think I'll get my $'s worth from Shining Force Neo. To a degree, my favortism or being biased is allowing me to think highly of this game. If this was labeled something else, maybe I wouldn't enjoy it as much, but I don't think this game is a complete waste like many others have proclaimed.

Not a classic from SEGA, just something a Shining Force fan should own, I guess.
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby Jup » Wed Nov 09 2005 5:12am

BUY..i bought and im satisfied with it!
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby Legend of Josh » Wed Nov 16 2005 2:59pm

This game is turning into one of my favorite games. Greatly impressed. The storyline is really, really good.
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby LunarMaster » Wed Nov 16 2005 6:52pm

Links between Shining Force and Shining Force Neo:
WARNING: SPOILER!


They would need to further expand on Shining Force Neo (perhaps in a sequal) to directly connect it to Shining Force, but the plots do agree with one another.
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby acri » Sat Nov 19 2005 8:19am

hmmm i have a lot of friends telling me this game is not up to the standard(i have a lot of friends who love sf series since 1). Being tied up by exams recently, i cant really play it but so far comments by them are not good... making me kinda dread playing this game now O_O
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Re: To buy or not to buy?

Postby Legend of Josh » Mon Nov 21 2005 2:47pm

hmmm i have a lot of friends telling me this game is not up to the standard(i have a lot of friends who love sf series since 1). Being tied up by exams recently, i cant really play it but so far comments by them are not good... making me kinda dread playing this game now O_O


If you're looking for a true "Shining" game, you should probably stay away. That is unless you're approaching Neo with an open mind. There's a good chance you will not enjoy Neo if you're only expecting a flawless game up to par with previous Shining releases.
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