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Okay, I have to ask.

Skull Mage

Incorporating Scenarios 1, 2, 3 and the Premium Disc, all in one handy board!

Okay, I have to ask.

Postby DomingoRules! » Wed Mar 01 2017 11:24am

How much HP exactly does the damn Skull Mage in Scenario 1 have? Granted I won the fight with only two casualties (the most I've had so far in a battle), it was so ridiculous that for a while I thought the reason he had ??? HP was because the game was simply keeping it concealed for the sake of a more uncertain battle. In turn, that got me very curious.
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Re: Okay, I have to ask.

Postby ZethaPonderer » Wed Mar 01 2017 6:00pm

1000 HP!!!!! Yes, the Skull Mage is probably the toughest enemy in SF3 - Scenario 1. Hate when he uses Soul Steal lvl2. Have your luck stat at 8 to never suffer instant death from that Spell.
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Re: Okay, I have to ask.

Postby DomingoRules! » Wed Mar 01 2017 8:23pm

Fortunately, of the two times he used that spell, it only killed Obright. Unfortunately, the one character he just had to exhaust with that was Obright, which is probably one of the most painful characters to lose in terms of reducing friendship bonuses.

Other than that, and one needless scare when the dragon rushed Noon, the only loss I suffered was when he solo hit Eldar with Tiamet because I got a bit antsy after rushing his wizard allies with a barrage of Spark Lv. 2-3 spells, not knowing if that would trigger the boss into moving.

I also found the Slow spell to be fairly useful. With all that HP, I feel like that extra few points of damage with every hit started to add up. It also got me thinking that Slow is probably a lot more useful on higher difficulties, but that's another topic entirely.
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Re: Okay, I have to ask.

Postby MCRT » Wed Mar 01 2017 11:10pm

Yeah, the Skull Mage is a resistant cookie :)
But I like how they balanced his damage capacity due giving him Soul Steal (when it hits multiple, it is more likely that someone wil get killed) and a high level Summon (kills any solo-hit without resist), therefore he actually requires some preparation to be sure that you will have no losses.

Slow affects every enemy, even the last bosses, so yeah on higher difficulties it will make your life easier (in addition to enabling ridiculous powerlevelling due to the fixed exp-points)
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Re: Okay, I have to ask.

Postby DomingoRules! » Thu Mar 02 2017 1:25am

Yeah, I love how the spell actually works. I never used it in other games because it didn't do enough for how unreliable it was to hit. On very rare occasions in older games, I would still use things like Dispel or Sleep, but Slow never felt like the payoff was worth the risk of missing.

I also noticed, and really like that approach to the Skull Mage. His spell selection really puts the player in a situation quite unlike most other bosses. Typically with a boss, there's a safe solution to the problem. With him however, the player is forced to choose what they believe to be the lesser of two evils, then hope their decision pays off. Considering how Eldar was hit for I believe 81 damage by Tiamet though, I imagine it's a rather tough spell to survivably resist. The best bet would probably be a mage or healer with Resist cast on them, but even then they don't have a whole lot of HP to withstand the blow.

Then of course there's also Sleep, but throughout the entire battle he didn't use that once. Made me wonder if casting that is just rare, or it only exists to make the boss seem a bit more intimidating than he actually is, like some enemies in Shining Force 2 who have spells such as Boost that they never use.
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Re: Okay, I have to ask.

Postby MCRT » Sat Mar 04 2017 3:10pm

Yeah, it also keeps the Skull Mage dangerous even when your Force really overpowered.

Poor Eldar... but even with resist the most high summons will outright kill most party members without giant HP-bars.
The highest damage his Tiamat can cause to one character is something around 100 HP (without dark reistance). But thankfully this is very rare.

I also cannot remember to see him casting sleep, but unlike the older SF titles I guess he would actually use it when the corresponding triggers are present, for example: all force members in range are grouped and all have a luck stat of 8, or somthing comparable.
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Re: Okay, I have to ask.

Postby DomingoRules! » Sun Mar 05 2017 1:19am

Yes, but at least she served me well in the second battle of that trial area. While everybody else basically just hung back, she flew straight up the pyramid to reach the battle's boss. She may not have the best stats in the game, but just the ability to fly alone I feel made her a huge asset throughout the game in ways no other character could match.
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Re: Okay, I have to ask.

Postby Lord Kane » Sun Mar 05 2017 9:53pm

MCRT wrote:The highest damage his Tiamat can cause to one character is something around 100 HP (without dark reistance). But thankfully this is very rare.

I also cannot remember to see him casting sleep, but unlike the older SF titles I guess he would actually use it when the corresponding triggers are present, for example: all force members in range are grouped and all have a luck stat of 8, or somthing comparable.


It's only 75 HP, but that's fair enough. ;)

And he never cast Sleep, when I met him, so I don't think, his AI is programmed to ever use it. Tiamat 2 and Soulsteal 2 is terrifying enough. ;)
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Re: Okay, I have to ask.

Postby MCRT » Mon Mar 06 2017 7:36pm

Lord Kane wrote:It's only 75 HP, but that's fair enough. ;)


I knew that posting stat-related statements would summon thee Lord Kane ;)

You're right, it is the base damage of the spell.
But if you remember this topic: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=26474
you will know that I wanted to test the whole spell-critical rumor :)

And while I unfortunately was not able yet to decipher the whole probablitys behind it and if it can be changed by "+critical-chance"-bonusses (at first i thought yes, but recent tests could not confirm it), what I can confirm is the following: spells do have a crit-like mechanic that is outside of the regular +/- 3 points random damage variance range :thumbsup:

The knack about it is: it is changes the damage by multiplication (kind of like the crits of SF II) unlike the physical crits/specials, which add a damage value.
Crits happen with all damage spells, but due to the damage multiplication they will just be far more obvious the stronger the spell is. The multiplicators (after random variance & resistance) are 100% (normal hit) and approximately 120% (crit) and approximately 140% (heavy crit)

You can test it yourself when you are patient enough ;)
Take a strong spellcaster, save your game and zap a poor helpless enemy. Note down the damage and reload.
Do this around 50 times (it makes no difference if you use savestates or regular saves, I did both to confirm if crits exist).
My first test spell was Thor 2 casted by Brigit (base 99) on a poor Lizardman in the Heroes test. I do not have my notes with the exact numbers at hand, but you will mostly see damage around 95-103 points. But from time to time you will also see damage around 124 (but never something between 110 and 120) and in rare cases even up to 147 points damage (but still with a clear never touched gap between the 2 higher possible ranges).

As all this number are from the same situation, the same caster, the same spell and the same victim, just repeated again and again and again... there is no way to explain this with normal damage variance or enemy resistances.
This may also be he reason why the Goldbeak-special sometimes also breaks the 100 damage frontier against enemys that are not weak against the element of the spell, despite having no weapon or affinity bonus to increase the damage.

Back to initial topic... even if I did no tests if this applies for enemy spells as well, I see no reason why they should be excluded from this mechanic and therefore in rare cases the Tiamat 2 spell of the Skull Mage should be able to reach 100 damage with a "heavy crit" ;)
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Re: Okay, I have to ask.

Postby Lord Kane » Mon Mar 20 2017 2:56pm

MCRT wrote:
I knew that posting stat-related statements would summon thee Lord Kane ;)


Right, your summon spell worked well. ;)

MCRT wrote:Crits happen with all damage spells, but due to the damage multiplication they will just be far more obvious the stronger the spell is. The multiplicators (after random variance & resistance) are 100% (normal hit) and approximately 120% (crit) and approximately 140% (heavy crit)


That is really new to me, that there are two kinds of magical critical hits! I tested much on magic attacks to find out certain resistances, but I never tested on the critical hits. So I can't verify/falsify this. [/quote]

MCRT wrote:My first test spell was Thor 2 casted by Brigit (base 99) on a poor Lizardman in the Heroes test. I do not have my notes with the exact numbers at hand, but you will mostly see damage around 95-103 points. But from time to time you will also see damage around 124 (but never something between 110 and 120) and in rare cases even up to 147 points damage (but still with a clear never touched gap between the 2 higher possible ranges).


Very interesting! I'll add here something, when i get access to my numbers soon.

MCRT wrote:Back to initial topic... even if I did no tests if this applies for enemy spells as well, I see no reason why they should be excluded from this mechanic and therefore in rare cases the Tiamat 2 spell of the Skull Mage should be able to reach 100 damage with a "heavy crit" ;)


Here I have to interfere. Enemies don't get critical hits with magic spells, I'm 100% sure! It's a "Force only" thing like counter attacks (while there are few exceptions).
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Re: Okay, I have to ask.

Postby MCRT » Tue Mar 21 2017 12:02am

Lord Kane wrote:
MCRT wrote:
I knew that posting stat-related statements would summon thee Lord Kane ;)


Right, your summon spell worked well. ;)


I practiced a lot until I had the perfect formula :lol:


Lord Kane wrote:
MCRT wrote:Crits happen with all damage spells, but due to the damage multiplication they will just be far more obvious the stronger the spell is. The multiplicators (after random variance & resistance) are 100% (normal hit) and approximately 120% (crit) and approximately 140% (heavy crit)


That is really new to me, that there are two kinds of magical critical hits! I tested much on magic attacks to find out certain resistances, but I never tested on the critical hits. So I can't verify/falsify this.


Yeah, it was also one of the main surprises for me.
In one of my recent tests those "heavy crits" did not happen when the caster had no weapon experienced with the equipped weapon(no weapon equipped. But as those tests were only 25 trials each time, this also could just have been random chance. So there is still a lot of things to find out.

I just noticed that the spell affinity can be changed with the SF 3 Editor, maybe I can confirm more accurate percentages (and if those are spell related or general) on my next test run with an elemental affinity stat of 100 :evilgrin:


Lord Kane wrote:
MCRT wrote:My first test spell was Thor 2 casted by Brigit (base 99) on a poor Lizardman in the Heroes test. I do not have my notes with the exact numbers at hand, but you will mostly see damage around 95-103 points. But from time to time you will also see damage around 124 (but never something between 110 and 120) and in rare cases even up to 147 points damage (but still with a clear never touched gap between the 2 higher possible ranges).


Very interesting! I'll add here something, when i get access to my numbers soon.


I am really looking forward to see your numbers.

Lord Kane wrote: I tested much on magic attacks to find out certain resistances


I just noticed that you can actually review the elemental resistances and spell affinities of the enemies in the editor. If you have no full list yet, I wanted to note down all this information anyway on my next playthrough :thumbsup:

Lord Kane wrote:
MCRT wrote:Back to initial topic... even if I did no tests if this applies for enemy spells as well, I see no reason why they should be excluded from this mechanic and therefore in rare cases the Tiamat 2 spell of the Skull Mage should be able to reach 100 damage with a "heavy crit" ;)


Here I have to interfere. Enemies don't get critical hits with magic spells, I'm 100% sure! It's a "Force only" thing like counter attacks (while there are few exceptions).


Yeah, from this point this makes sense. In this case, the maximum damage would be 75 + whatever the dark affinity stat of the Skull Mage is (at least for the party members that do not have negative dark resistance)

Oh my, this is some real learning through discourse, Sokrates would be proud of us :lol:
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Re: Okay, I have to ask.

Postby Lord Kane » Wed Mar 29 2017 10:24pm

MCRT wrote:
Lord Kane wrote:
MCRT wrote:My first test spell was Thor 2 casted by Brigit (base 99) on a poor Lizardman in the Heroes test. I do not have my notes with the exact numbers at hand, but you will mostly see damage around 95-103 points. But from time to time you will also see damage around 124 (but never something between 110 and 120) and in rare cases even up to 147 points damage (but still with a clear never touched gap between the 2 higher possible ranges).


Very interesting! I'll add here something, when i get access to my numbers soon.


I am really looking forward to see your numbers.


OK, here you are: I just wanted to look up the lightning resistance of lizardmen to calculate the possible damage outcomes without critical hits. It is -10%.

So for Brigit (99, Thor 2): average = 108; min=94; max=122 or simply: [94;122]

The problem now is, even if a "normal" critical hit is "+25%", the new damage output range would be [117;153]. You see, both ranges intersect each other, so for 117 to 122 you can't say, if it is a normal or a critical hit.
That's why I hate the fact, that they hid magical critical hits in SFIII unlike all other SF-games! :angry:


MCRT wrote:
Lord Kane wrote: I tested much on magic attacks to find out certain resistances


I just noticed that you can actually review the elemental resistances and spell affinities of the enemies in the editor. If you have no full list yet, I wanted to note down all this information anyway on my next playthrough :thumbsup:


I'm only missing the resistance values for:
Assassin
Dark Mage
Shiraf
(Train Battles, Scenario I)
and
Aspia Knight
Fafhard
(Fafhard-Battle in front of Flaggard, Scenario I).
I wasn't able to extract those values from the editor. It would be great if you could get them. ;)

MCRT wrote:
Lord Kane wrote:
MCRT wrote:Back to initial topic... even if I did no tests if this applies for enemy spells as well, I see no reason why they should be excluded from this mechanic and therefore in rare cases the Tiamat 2 spell of the Skull Mage should be able to reach 100 damage with a "heavy crit" ;)


Here I have to interfere. Enemies don't get critical hits with magic spells, I'm 100% sure! It's a "Force only" thing like counter attacks (while there are few exceptions).


Yeah, from this point this makes sense. In this case, the maximum damage would be 75 + whatever the dark affinity stat of the Skull Mage is (at least for the party members that do not have negative dark resistance)

Oh my, this is some real learning through discourse, Sokrates would be proud of us :lol:


Skull Mage has "+0" dark affinity. ;)
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Re: Okay, I have to ask.

Postby MCRT » Sat Apr 01 2017 4:34pm

Lord Kane wrote:OK, here you are: I just wanted to look up the lightning resistance of lizardmen to calculate the possible damage outcomes without critical hits. It is -10%.

So for Brigit (99, Thor 2): average = 108; min=94; max=122 or simply: [94;122]

The problem now is, even if a "normal" critical hit is "+25%", the new damage output range would be [117;153]. You see, both ranges intersect each other, so for 117 to 122 you can't say, if it is a normal or a critical hit.
That's why I hate the fact, that they hid magical critical hits in SFIII unlike all other SF-games! :angry:


Ah, great, they have a negative resistance, this solves the mystery of the small gap (which then is just caused by multiplication of the regular damage variance) and the big gap (apparently crit's).

How is the formula you used? It appears to be pretty accurate.

And neverthelesse, at least my tests could clearly confirm that crits exist :)

Can you confirm me an enemy type in the hero's test that has lightning resistance 0 ?

Lord Kane wrote:I'm only missing the resistance values for:
Assassin
Dark Mage
Shiraf
(Train Battles, Scenario I)
and
Aspia Knight
Fafhard
(Fafhard-Battle in front of Flaggard, Scenario I).
I wasn't able to extract those values from the editor. It would be great if you could get them. ;)


I may do a quick run to get those stats for you.

Looking at this example I may ask the question: do the resistances of the same enemies differ between different battles and/or scenario's?

Did you post all those stats somewhere so far? I haven't seen anything in the forum.


Lord Kane wrote:Skull Mage has "+0" dark affinity. ;)


Therefore he only does the base damage with his dark spells. Do you know all affinities of all enemies?

Do enemies actually get the damage bonus from weapons? I would guess no but maybe I am wrong :)
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Re: Okay, I have to ask.

Postby Lord Kane » Sun Apr 02 2017 8:07pm

MCRT wrote:
How is the formula you used? It appears to be pretty accurate.


The formula is something like: variation = damage/7-1 but it is rounded in a strange way so here are the breakpoints:

dam variation(+/-)
0-13 0
14-19 1
20-26 2
27-33 3
34-39 4
40-46 5
47-53 6
54-59 7
............
MCRT wrote:Can you confirm me an enemy type in the hero's test that has lightning resistance 0 ?

Yes: Killer Fish, Ghoul, Minotaur, Bugbear, Lesser Demon, Salamander, Sting Worm, Durahan, Colossuss, Arch Demon and Taros. ;)

MCRT wrote:Looking at this example I may ask the question: do the resistances of the same enemies differ between different battles and/or scenario's?

Yes, they do. In both cases.

MCRT wrote:Did you post all those stats somewhere so far? I haven't seen anything in the forum.


I don't think so, it's quite a long list. So see the end of my post. ;)

MCRT wrote:
Lord Kane wrote:Skull Mage has "+0" dark affinity. ;)


Therefore he only does the base damage with his dark spells. Do you know all affinities of all enemies?

Yes, except for the told Dark Mage in the train battles. ;)
MCRT wrote:Do enemies actually get the damage bonus from weapons? I would guess no but maybe I am wrong :)

Your guess is right. Since they don't get weapon levels they don't get these boni, too.

Enemy Resistances
Scenario I
Enemy Earth Fire Ice Bolt Wind Light Dark
Mask Monk (blue) 0 0 5 -5 0 -20 20
Mask Monk (blue) 0 0 5 -5 0 -20 20
Bat 0 -15 -5 -5 -30 -20 10
Mask Monk, red 0 0 5 -5 0 -20 20
Saraband Knight 0 -5 -2 0 0 0 0
Defense Commander 0 -5 -2 -5 0 0 0
Scaven 0 -2 0 0 5 -5 5
Worm 0 -35 10 0 0 -5 0
Sniper 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Dark Mage 10 15 15 10 5 -10 20
Thief 0 -5 5 -5 5 -5 10
Thief Commander 0 2 2 2 2 0 0
Birdman 0 -5 -5 -10 -35 0 0
Goblin 0 0 0 -5 0 -5 8
Destonia Soldier 0 -5 0 -5 0 0 0
Thief 0 -5 5 -5 5 -5 10
Imperial Mage 10 15 15 15 15 0 0
Priest 10 10 10 10 18 20 5
Battalion Leader 0 -2 0 -5 0 0 0
Dwarf 0 -5 0 -5 0 -8 -5
MP Commander 0 -2 0 -5 0 0 0
Assassin
Dark Mage
Shiraf
Vampire Bat 0 -5 0 0 -35 -10 10
Skeleton 0 -10 10 -30 -10 -50 10
Lich 0 10 30 10 -20 -30 30
Succubus 0 20 10 10 -50 0 30
Vandal (Abdark) 0 5 10 15 -15 -20 30
Kaiser Guard 0 -2 0 -10 0 0 0
Mega Loader 0 0 -2 -2 0 0 0
Imperial Knight 0 2 0 2 0 0 0
Master Mage 0 15 15 10 5 0 0
Franz 0 0 0 5 0 5 0
White Lord 0 0 -5 -10 0 0 -10
Spiriel 0 3 3 3 3 4 2
Thief 0 -5 5 -5 5 -5 10
Aspia Soldier 0 0 -5 0 -5 0 -5
Wing Knight 0 -5 -5 -5 -40 0 0
Garzel 0 0 8 0 0 -10 10
Hell Hound 0 5 -10 -5 0 0 20
Baersol Soldier 0 0 -5 0 -2 0 -2
Dire Wolf 0 8 8 8 8 0 0
Hydra 0 10 -15 -5 -5 0 0
Aspia Mage 15 15 15 15 15 0 15
High Priest 15 20 20 20 20 30 10
Force Commander 0 -5 0 -5 0 0 0
Mercenary 0 -5 0 -5 0 0 0
Commander 0 -10 -10 -20 0 0 0
Thief 0 -5 5 -5 5 -5 10
Blood Born 0 20 -10 -30 -10 -50 10

Enemy Earth Fire Ice Bolt Wind Light Dark
Wyvern 0 30 -20 -10 -30 10 -5

Baby Dragon 0 20 -15 -10 -10 0 0
Aspia Knight
Fafhard 15
Mask Monk (blue) 0 0 5 -5 0 -20 20
Lizardman 0 -10 20 -10 0 0 0
Mask Monk (red) 10 10 10 10 10 -10 20
Thief 0 -5 5 -5 5 -5 10
Harpy 0 -5 -10 -5 -40 0 0
Cerberus 0 40 -20 -10 -5 0 0
Fiale 10 20 30 30 20 20 30
Mask Monk (purple) 10 10 10 10 10 -20 20
Golem 0 0 0 -20 -10 0 0
Sting Worm 0 -30 -10 0 -5 0 0
Queen Worm 0 -20 -15 -10 -5 0 0

Giant Armor 0 0 0 -20 -10 0 0
Silver Knight 0 0 0 0 10 10 -20
Aspia Mage 10 20 20 20 20 20 10
Bow Knight 0 8 8 8 8 0 0
Wilmer 0 15 0 40 0 0 0

Griffon 0 0 0 -10 -30 0 0
Sorcerer 10 20 20 20 20 20 20
Braff 0 10 0 20 0 -10 -10
Thief 0 -5 5 -5 5 -5 10
Spiriel 0 3 3 3 3 4 2
Minotaur 0 0 -50 0 -30 0 0
Basanda 10 30 20 20 20 20 20
Giga Breaker 0 -15 -10 -20 -15 0 0
Blue Dragon 0 -15 30 -10 -20 0 0
High Wizard 15 15 15 15 15 20 15
Skull Mage 15 20 20 20 20 15 40
Twiggy 15 15 15 20 20 30 0
Piper 10 15 20 25 15 15 15

Elrick 0 3 0 8 3 10 -5

Dongo 0 2 2 -2 -2 -5 -2
Colossus 15 15 15 15 15 15 20
Arrawnt 10 10 10 10 10 10 10


Scenario 2

Enemy Earth Fire Ice Bolt Wind Light Dark
Mask Monk (blue) 0 0 5 -5 0 -20 20
Bat 0 -15 -5 -5 -30 -20 10
Crewart Soldier 0 -5 0 -5 0 0 0
Crewart Leader 0 -5 0 -5 0 0 0
Saraband Knight 0 -5 -2 0 0 0 0
Thief 0 -5 5 -5 5 -5 10
Masked Priest 0 0 5 -5 0 -20 20
Masked Mage (purp.) 0 0 0 0 0 -20 20
Dwarf 0 -5 0 -5 0 -8 -5
Sniper 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Aspinia Knight 0 -5 0 0 -5 0 0
Priest 10 10 10 10 18 20 5
Aspinia Mage 15 15 15 15 15 15 0
Birdman 0 -5 -5 -10 -35 0 0
Varlant 0 -10 0 -15 0 0 0
Aspinia Soldier 0 0 -5 0 -5 0 -5
Stella 0 0 0 -5 10 10 -10
Destonia Soldier 0 -5 0 -5 0 0 0
Imperial Mage 10 15 15 15 15 0 0
Imperial Knight 0 2 0 2 0 0 0
Kaiser Guard 0 -2 0 -10 0 0 0
Scaven 0 -2 0 0 5 -5 5
Goblin 0 0 0 -5 0 -5 8
Vampire Bat 0 -5 0 0 -35 -10 10
Worm 0 -35 10 0 0 -5 0
Succubus 0 20 10 10 -50 0 30
Edmund Soldier (Hal.) 0 0 -5 0 -5 0 -5
Aspia Mage 10 20 20 20 20 20 10
Wing Knight 0 -5 -5 -5 -40 0 0
Edmund Soldier (Axe) 0 0 -5 0 -5 0 -5
Edmund Commander 0 -5 0 -5 0 0 0
Zombie 0 -30 20 -10 0 -20 25
Skeleton 0 -10 10 -30 -10 -50 10
Dire Wolf 0 8 8 8 8 0 0
Wolf Baron 0 -10 2 0 5 0 5

Hedoba 5 10 15 10 20 10 5
Masked Monk (brown) 0 0 0 0 0 -20 20
Masked Mage (green) 15 15 15 15 15 15 0
Lizardman 0 -10 20 -10 0 0 0
Thief 0 -5 5 -5 5 -5 10
Scissor Crab 0 -30 15 0 0 0 0
Tentacle Leg 0 -20 10 -10 0 0 0
Tentacle Arm 0 -20 10 -10 0 0 0
Dark Kraken 0 -20 10 -10 0 0 0

Bulzome Knight 0 2 2 2 2 0 0
Masked Pegasus 0 0 0 0 -40 -10 0
Hellhound 0 5 -10 -5 0 0 20
Assassin 0 8 8 0 -5 0 10
Thief 0 -5 5 -5 5 -5 10
Masked Monk (red) 10 10 10 10 10 -10 20
Masked Monk (blue) 0 0 5 -5 0 -20 20
Wing Knight 0 -5 -5 -5 -40 0 0
Crewart Soldier 0 -5 0 -5 0 0 0
Enemy Earth Fire Ice Bolt Wind Light Dark
Mercenary 0 -5 0 -5 0 0 0
Master Mage 0 15 15 10 5 0 0
Crewart 0 -5 0 -5 0 0 0
Masked Monk (grey) 0 0 0 0 0 -20 20
Commander 0 -5 -2 -5 0 0 0
Silver Knight 0 3 0 8 3 10 -5
Silver Knight 0 0 0 0 10 10 -20
High Priest 15 20 20 20 20 30 10
Harpy 0 -5 -10 -5 -40 0 0
Dessheren 10 30 20 20 20 20 20
Baersol Soldier 0 0 -5 0 -2 0 -2
Giga Breaker 0 -10 -10 -20 0 0 0
Mega Loader 0 0 -2 -2 0 0 0
Hill Giant 0 -10 10 -20 0 0 0
Jade 15 15 15 20 20 30 0
Dakka 0 -5 -5 0 10 20 15
Thief 0 -5 5 -5 5 -5 10
Cyos 0 0 0 25 0 -5 5
Sting Worm 0 -30 -10 0 -5 0 0
Hydra 0 10 -15 -5 -5 0 0
Hell Sniper 0 -5 0 0 -15 -20 20
Masked Monk (purple) 10 10 10 10 10 -20 20
Queen Worm 0 -20 -15 -10 -5 0 0

Blood Born 0 20 -10 -30 -10 -50 10
Wyvern 0 30 -20 -10 -30 10 -5
Baby Dragon 0 20 -15 -10 -10 0 0
Ark Dragon 0 20 -10 -5 -5 0 0
Minotaur 0 0 -50 0 -30 0 0
Dessheren 10 20 20 20 20 20 20
Cerberus 0 40 -20 -10 -5 0 0
Griffon 0 0 0 -10 -30 0 0
Clay Golem 0 0 0 -20 -10 0 0
Necromancer 0 10 15 45 -5 -20 30
Bow Knight 0 8 8 8 8 0 0
Pegasus Knight 0 0 -5 0 -40 10 -5
Giga Breaker 0 -15 -10 -20 -15 0 0
Sorcerer 10 20 20 20 20 20 20
Mad Garvin 0 5 10 15 -15 -20 30
Fynnding & Team
Giant Armour 0 0 0 -20 -10 0 0
Yasha 10 10 10 10 10 10 10
Tybalt 0 -2 0 -10 0 0 0

Scenario 3

Enemy Earth Fire Ice Bolt Wind Light Dark
Masked Monk 0 0 0 0 0 -20 20
Masked Pegasus 0 0 0 0 -40 -10 0
Dire Wolf 0 8 8 8 8 0 0
Masked Mage 15 15 15 15 15 15 0
Lizardman 0 -10 20 -10 0 0 0
Thief 0 -5 5 -5 5 -5 10
Enemy Earth Fire Ice Bolt Wind Light Dark
Masked Priest 0 0 5 -5 0 -20 20
Goriate 10 20 30 30 20 20 30
Killer Fish 0 -10 10 0 -10 0 0
Helm Club 0 -30 15 0 0 0 0
Blood Born 0 20 -10 -30 -10 -50 10
Ghoul 0 -10 5 0 -10 -20 10
Brute 0 -5 5 0 -5 -20 10
Green Dragon 0 20 -10 -5 -15 0 0
Thief 0 -5 5 -5 5 -5 10
White Dragon 0 5 5 5 -15 0 -5
Destonian Soldier 0 -5 0 -5 0 0 0
Metal Gunner 0 0 -2 -2 0 0 0
Imperial Knight 0 2 0 2 0 0 0
Black Knight 0 0 0 -2 0 -5 10
Defenda 0 0 0 70 0 0 10

Baersol Soldier 0 0 -5 0 -5 0 -5
Wing Knight 0 -5 -5 -5 -40 0 0
Mega Loader 0 0 -2 -2 0 0 0
Heretic Golem 0 0 0 -20 -10 0 0

Masked Mage 0 0 0 0 0 -20 20
Mercenary 0 5 0 -5 0 0 0
Aspinia Mage 15 15 15 15 15 15 0
Giga Breaker 0 -10 -10 -20 0 0 0
Hill Giant 0 -10 10 -20 0 0 0
Produn 0 0 5 0 3 3 3
Masked Monk 234 15 15 15 15 15 15 0
Minotaur 0 0 -50 0 -30 0 0
Pegasus Knight 0 0 -5 0 -40 10 -5
Red Dragon 0 20 -10 -5 -15 0 0
Thief 0 -5 5 -5 5 -5 10
Edmund 0 0 0 2 5 0 3
Masked Monk 0 0 5 -5 0 -20 20

Ninja (green) 10 10 10 10 10 -10 20
Ninja (blue) 10 10 10 10 10 -10 20
Ninja (purple) 10 20 20 20 20 20 10
Yasha 10 10 10 10 10 10 10

Kudan 0 0 0 15 -5 -5 10

Hell Hound 0 5 -10 -5 0 0 20
Slash Bat 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Giant Ant 0 0 -10 -15 0 0 20
Red Dragon 0 20 -10 -5 -15 0 0
Bugbear 0 -5 5 0 5 0 0
Hydra 0 10 -15 -5 -5 0 0
Hell Succubus 0 10 20 10 -50 0 30
Thief 0 -5 5 -5 5 -5 10
Chimera 0 10 0 -5 -20 0 0
Kaiser Knight 0 -5 0 0 -2 0 0
Rainblood Bishop 15 15 15 20 20 30 0
Rainblood Pawn 0 8 3 0 3 10 -5

Cerberus 0 40 -20 -10 -5 0 0
Sandworm 0 -30 -10 0 -5 0 0
Blue Dragon 0 -15 30 -10 -20 0 0
Enemy Earth Fire Ice Bolt Wind Light Dark
Skull Fish 0 0 10 5 -20 -5 15
Thief 0 -5 5 -5 5 -5 10
Skull Warrior 0 -10 10 -20 -10 -30 10
Yeti 0 -10 10 0 5 0 0
Gargoyle 0 0 10 -15 -20 -10 10
Marky 10 10 25 15 20 15 20

Earth Dragon 0 5 -5 -10 0 -30 10
Galm 0 10 10 10 -5 -10 30

Bloody Knight 0 0 0 -20 -10 0 10
Lich 0 10 30 10 -20 -30 30
Rainblood Rook 0 -2 2 -2 2 -5 -2
Rainblood Queen 0 5 2 -2 2 -5 -2
Synbios' Force
Yasha 10 10 10 10 10 10 10

Lesser Demon 0 0 0 0 -20 -10 5
Salamander 0 80 -10 0 0 10 0
Blue 0 20 30 30 20 -50 20
Dark Gunner 0 0 -5 -5 0 0 0
Masked Mage 15 15 15 15 15 -20 10
Ice Golem 0 -30 60 0 0 -10 0
Rainblood Knight 10 25 15 20 15 15 15
Rainblood King 5 5 5 35 5 10 0
Medion's Force
High Priest (red) 15 15 15 15 15 20 30
Harpy 0 -5 -10 -5 -40 0 0
Sting Worm 0 -30 -10 0 -5 0 0
Blue Dragon 0 -15 30 -10 -20 0 0
Griffon 0 0 0 -10 -30 0 0
Durahan 0 0 0 0 -10 -20 30
Black Dragon 0 -5 10 30 -10 -20 20

Colossus 0 0 0 0 -10 0 30
Arch Demon 0 0 0 0 -5 -10 30
Taros 0 -10 0 0 0 15 20
Dragonnewt 0 30 30 -5 -5 0 0
Demon Knight 0 10 0 -5 -20 -5 10
High Priest (purple) 15 15 15 15 15 20 30
High Priest (green) 15 15 15 15 15 20 30
Braff 0 10 0 20 0 -10 -10
Basanda 10 30 20 20 20 20 20
Dessheren 10 30 20 20 20 20 20
Fiale 10 20 30 30 20 20 30
Goriate 10 20 30 30 20 20 30
Jane 15 15 15 15 15 20 15

Bulzome 15 15 15 15 15 -20 15

Premium Disk

Enemy Earth Fire Ice Bolt Wind Light Dark
Tentacle Arm 0 -20 10 -10 0 0 0
Tentacle Leg 0 -20 10 -10 0 0 0
Dark Kraken 0 -20 10 -10 0 0 0

High Shinobi 10 20 20 20 20 20 10
Yasha 10 10 10 10 10 10 10
Yasha 10 10 10 10 10 10 10
Rainblood Bishop 15 15 15 20 20 30 0
Rainblood Pawn 0 8 3 0 3 10 -5
Rainblood Rook 0 -2 2 -2 2 -5 -2
Rainblood Knight 10 25 15 20 15 15 15
Rainblood King 5 5 5 35 5 10 0
Rainblood Queen 0 5 2 -2 2 -5 -2
Fiale 10 20 30 30 20 20 30
Basanda 10 30 20 20 20 20 20
Dessheren 10 30 20 20 20 20 20
Goriate 10 20 30 30 20 20 30
Dark Priest (red) 15 15 15 15 15 20 30
Dark Priest (purple) 15 15 15 15 15 20 30
Dark Priest (green) 15 15 15 15 15 20 30
Bulzome 15 15 15 15 15 -20 15

Thief 0 15 -10 -15 10 -20 20
Villager (right) 0 -15 10 20 -10 -20 20
Villager (middle) 0 -5 10 30 -10 -20 20

Iom (inner) 0 10 10 10 -10 -10 20
Iom (outer) 0 10 10 10 -10 -10 20

Iom (main) 0 10 10 10 -10 -10 20

Zeon 15 10 10 10 15 -20 15
Darksol 15 15 15 15 15 -20 15
Lord Kane

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Re: Okay, I have to ask.

Postby MCRT » Tue Apr 04 2017 1:08pm

Lord Kane wrote:
The formula is something like: variation = damage/7-1 but it is rounded in a strange way so here are the breakpoints:

dam variation(+/-)
0-13 0
14-19 1
20-26 2
27-33 3
34-39 4
40-46 5
47-53 6
54-59 7


Hmm, this explains the really big damage difference when playing around with high power characters against low power enemies (for example: strange stuff like that a regular attack does more damage than the first special)
Lord Kane wrote:Yes: Killer Fish, Ghoul, Minotaur, Bugbear, Lesser Demon, Salamander, Sting Worm, Durahan, Colossuss, Arch Demon and Taros. ;)


Hehe, poor victims of my wrath :evilgrin:
let's see how thor 2 looks like with a lightning affinity of 100

Lord Kane wrote:I don't think so, it's quite a long list. So see the end of my post. ;)


Woohoo, thanks a lot :D

Lord Kane wrote:
MCRT wrote:Therefore he only does the base damage with his dark spells. Do you know all affinities of all enemies?

Yes, except for the told Dark Mage in the train battles. ;)


It is 0 0 0 0 0 0 0

While doing a quick look I noticed that almost every spellcasting enemy, except some bosses like sc 3 Braff / Basanda, seem to have 0 for everything only, am I correct?

To complete your list (following your format)
Assassin 0 8 8 0 -5 0 10
Dark Mage 10 10 10 10 15 -10 20
Shiraf 0 -5 -10 -15 -10 0 5

To get those was already a little bit tricky, but Fafhard seems to be almost impossible, but I will keep trying to find a way :thumbsup:
MCRT

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Re: Okay, I have to ask.

Postby Lord Kane » Sun Apr 09 2017 8:05pm

MCRT wrote:
Lord Kane wrote:
MCRT wrote:Therefore he only does the base damage with his dark spells. Do you know all affinities of all enemies?

Yes, except for the told Dark Mage in the train battles. ;)


It is 0 0 0 0 0 0 0

While doing a quick look I noticed that almost every spellcasting enemy, except some bosses like sc 3 Braff / Basanda, seem to have 0 for everything only, am I correct?

To complete your list (following your format)
Assassin 0 8 8 0 -5 0 10
Dark Mage 10 10 10 10 15 -10 20
Shiraf 0 -5 -10 -15 -10 0 5

To get those was already a little bit tricky, but Fafhard seems to be almost impossible, but I will keep trying to find a way :thumbsup:


Thank you very much for the missing values! The editor didn't work for me for these 3 special battles, so I wasn't able to get them. I only got Fafhards cold resistance value (15) by hard long old school ingame testing. :)
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